FlankerNation Posted November 17, 2014 Author Share Posted November 17, 2014 Hey, please don't be angry with me. I just wanted to help. If I offended you in any way, I apologize. If it helps, I can send you one of these as I heard all the ace pilots use them: Ahhh so sweet of you no thanks I don't use this, I use a Keyboard which people are using for centuries. I thought you knew about :doh: you poor thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
159th_Viper Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) So in Su27 PFM I want that Full aft stick hold and not auto-partial center it self You have it already: Disengage the AoA and Ny limiter (S-key). Oh yes, my stick also auto-centers, same as your keyboard input. Edited November 18, 2014 by 159th_Viper Novice or Veteran looking for an alternative MP career? Click me to commence your Journey of Pillage and Plunder! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] '....And when I get to Heaven, to St Peter I will tell.... One more Soldier reporting Sir, I've served my time in Hell......' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepec9124 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 It can be done, but as pointed out it 's done by flight computer. In another words not realistic. On the other hand we already have "auto rudder" for Mustang so why not. Just let server admin decide if it 's allowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
159th_Viper Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I understand what he means... when he presses the down button for example he'd like the stick axis to remain still where it is in game (trim-like) when he unpresses it. It does remain where it is when the Up or Down-arrow is released via keyboard. The issue is with the pitch-input re-entering when pitch input is full aft. Irrespective of keyboard or Flight-Stick, auto-centering is by design/function of the AoA and Ny limiter. In other words, even if you were flying with a broom-handle, the IFCS WILL move your pitch from full aft to nearer centre. Disengage the AoA and Ny limiters and full aft pitch remains in both keyboard and flight-stick. Novice or Veteran looking for an alternative MP career? Click me to commence your Journey of Pillage and Plunder! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] '....And when I get to Heaven, to St Peter I will tell.... One more Soldier reporting Sir, I've served my time in Hell......' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlankerNation Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 You have it already: Disengage the AoA and Ny limiter (S-key). Oh yes, my stick also auto-centers, same as your keyboard input. Ofcourse it will auto-center but does the stick force your hand auto-center ? No You can hold it full aft so in keyboard we should do that also. I will post a detail video what I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulienBlanc Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 It doesn't force our hands, but any input beyond the limiter is neglected. So no we can't hold it full aft... If I understood this correctly. That's where the S button kicks in, to allow the input to exactly correspond to what you want it to do. Allowing for these said "ultra hardcore beyond 50% deflection" causing severe G's to occur and severe speed loss. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Gigabyte GTX 970 G1 Intel i7-4790K 4GHz H100i 256 GB SSD + 1TB HDD Crucial+ WD Blue 16 Gb Ram DDR3-1866-C9R Mhz Veng. Pro. GA-Z97X-G5 SuperNova 750 G2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlankerNation Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) YYOUuuureeeekkkaaaa ! It doesn't force our hands, but any input beyond the limiter is neglected. So no we can't hold it full aft... If I understood this correctly. That's where the S button kicks in, to allow the input to exactly correspond to what you want it to do. Allowing for these said "ultra hardcore beyond 50% deflection" causing severe G's to occur and severe speed loss. I think you have explained the solution to me, we are getting there just want to ask this if I press S key I don't want to turn it ON again by itself, is it possible that want to toggle it on/off (ny) by myself ? :unsure: Edited November 18, 2014 by FlankerNation making it more clear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlankerNation Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 It can be done, but as pointed out it 's done by flight computer. In another words not realistic. On the other hand we already have "auto rudder" for Mustang so why not. Just let server admin decide if it 's allowed. Auto Center Rudder is fine :thumbup: Auto Center Aileron is fine :thumbup: Auto Center Pitch with 50% auto forward during full aft is not fine, no no :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
159th_Viper Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Ofcourse it will auto-center but does the stick force your hand auto-center ? No You can hold it full aft so in keyboard we should do that also. Good Lord man I've explained this like 4 times already. Listen - No, I cannot hold it full aft with my flight-stick. It auto-centres as well. What you experience with your keyboard is exactly the same as what I experience with my flight-stick. I'll repeat - exactly the same. Novice or Veteran looking for an alternative MP career? Click me to commence your Journey of Pillage and Plunder! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] '....And when I get to Heaven, to St Peter I will tell.... One more Soldier reporting Sir, I've served my time in Hell......' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlankerNation Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 Good Lord man I've explained this like 4 times already. Listen - No, I cannot hold it full aft with my flight-stick. It auto-centres as well. What you experience with your keyboard is exactly the same as what I experience with my flight-stick. I'll repeat - exactly the same. Ok Done :thumbup:..... close this thread I will make another one for the rights of Keyboard Warrior to play DCS heheheheh no i m kidding. ... i don't know :pilotfly: Anyway, you can close this thread but before you do that please answer this when pressing S key to turn OFF AoA Ny, it will not turn ON by itself ? i mean it would be better for to let it off and if I want to turn it ON again I will press S key again ? Thank You, FN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTFDarkEagle Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Anyway, you can close this thread but before you do that please answer this when pressing S key to turn OFF AoA Ny, it will not turn ON by itself ? i mean it would be better for to let it off and if I want to turn it ON again I will press S key again ? Correct. Press 'S' once, it toggles off. You need to press 'S' again to switch it back on. 1 Lukas - "TIN TIN" - 9th Shrek Air Strike Squadron TIN TIN's Cockpit thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weta43 Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 The switch is animated - you can see if it's on by looking.. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlankerNation Posted November 19, 2014 Author Share Posted November 19, 2014 Thank You guys, I will fly tonight and test it out..... May ED and DCS Series live many years to come.... Ameeen ........ And Mr. Putin for giving us the 35s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepec9124 Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Um, btw switch is hidden by throttle when it's on max setting. I would recommend to go Mach 1< and then start testing. It seems most stable at such speeds imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlankerNation Posted November 21, 2014 Author Share Posted November 21, 2014 And the results are horrible. I tested yesterday doing dogfights and once you hit that switch.................. just don't ask. So, here it is.... IT'S BUG the keyboard flight controls should be fix. This not related to IFC because I commence another test where I press and hold down the " Down Arrow Key " to have Full AFT pitch and maintained it the plane didn't pull back 50% partial pitch. So its a BUG and it is there with the EAGLE also ED has confirmed it in the thread. Please ED switch back the way we control (maintain the pitch) before. I m going to report this with the support team as here in the forums really don't understand at all. Also we cannot ignore the fact they people like me who want to control the complex AFM with keyboard, and it can be done and has been done in other titles (not arcade sim) example FSX and Xplane. Xplane has a complex AFM and still they gave the option to fly with the keyboard. Ignoring the real problem and constantly bombing with sarcasm won't show the professionalism and dedication towards your client and interest in the future coming titles.... at least for me. Please ED this nothing to do with the flanker and the modeling of the flight dynamics and I can proof it with a video but as I have busy schedule and don't have to make a video that's why I can't. Let's see what the support team say when I issue the ticket on the DCS site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaelu Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) Can you do a barrel roll around a friend in another plane while looking continuously at him? Can you scratch your nose in that time and tell a joke? Some of us are more concern about having fun with friends than "kicking butts"... Other than that... I don't think ED will lose time with trying to simulate the fidelity of a Joystick and the response curves of it on a keyboard... Maybe in a future module called "DCS Joystick Simulator" You should try to find a software for a Virtual Joystick and make it work with Keyboard. This way you will just set it in DCS like a normal Joystick and be happy with it. examples: vjoy (comes with FaceTrackNoIR... LOL) http://vjoystick.sourceforge.net/site/ Qu3S0Q6M0tY or the older: ppjoy http://ppjoy.en.malavida.com/ rxCwbJSRpOQ Edited November 21, 2014 by zaelu 1 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] I5 4670k, 32GB, GTX 1070, Thrustmaster TFRP, G940 Throttle extremely modded with Bodnar 0836X and Bu0836A, Warthog Joystick with F-18 grip, Oculus Rift S - Almost all is made from gifts from friends, the most expensive parts at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted November 21, 2014 ED Team Share Posted November 21, 2014 Also we cannot ignore the fact they people like me who want to control the complex AFM with keyboard, and it can be done and has been done in other titles (not arcade sim) example FSX and Xplane. Xplane has a complex AFM and still they gave the option to fly with the keyboard. Dont assume what they are doing in other sims is comparable to here (AFM is so overused out there now its become pretty much meaningless), honestly I dont know, but if I was a betting man I would put my money on them not spending much time (if any) at all on keyboard support for PFM. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoll Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 (edited) This is a strange feeling of being alone in being right, facing the multitude quibbling anything for fear of the unknown. Comfort and consumerism ... it's just be why we eventually sum so little to fly (IRL). I'm not a keyborard warrior, and honestly, my first reaction to this post was: "What idiot kindly fly with a keyboard." But after reading this topic i wanna bring my support, FlankerNation I am 100% with you. After keyboard behavior testing, specially in "s" mode, result is without compromise, what up/down keys do, is only no sense. Just test it, you will be surprised. Good Lord man I've explained this like 4 times already. ... What you experience with your keyboard is exactly the same as what I experience with my flight-stick. I'll repeat - exactly the same. Sorry Viper, you can tell this 100 times, that's not true. Ok, look on marks on the tail, 15 up 21 low, you can notice that in between 5 low and 10 up, up/down keys apply a value without auto centre, acting as Trim, but in between 5 and 21 low : auto centre to 5 low. in between 10 and 15 up : auto centre to 10 up. that is definitely not what i get with joystick. One more time, sorry, but i call this "a bug" Sorry (!) for language, i'm French. Edited November 22, 2014 by Scoll linguistic translation 1 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j.sabo12 Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Surely isn't auto centering the best? I flew sims some time before I got a stick (one of the best things I bought) and there were two different control systems. The first as in IL-2, where everything auto centered itself and the other one, like in FSX/2004, where it didn't. I must say that the auto centering was much better, it actually made the plane controllable and I was able to make quick changes to the control surfaces. Boeing 737 NG instructor at Simulator Centrum in Bratislava, Slovakia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit_ Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I found this thread really bizzare. Seeing someone commenting on AFM or PFM and flying with keyboard....hmmmmm...let's say it's very unusual and very nonsense. :-) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weta43 Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Not if he can do it... Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoll Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 DCS World 1.2.12 Open Beta Change Log ... Su-27. Adjusted keyboard controls ... maybe the good one ? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlankerNation Posted December 9, 2014 Author Share Posted December 9, 2014 DCS World 1.2.12 Open Beta Change Log ... Su-27. Adjusted keyboard controls ... maybe the good one ? Yes, I was relieved but Nope problem is still there. But there is something new with W key they suggesting me will check it out soon. Finger crossed :joystick: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolek Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Yes, I was relieved but Nope problem is still there. Are you sure? I just tested it and when I move the stick forward/back using the up/down arrow keys it stays put after I release the key. It does not recenter by itself. I thought that this was what you (we) wanted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witchking Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 BTW....regd why keyboard is still part of controls.... its for all the systems that you possibly cannot map to any hotas available today. I used to fly flanker 2 with keyboard..but upgraded to logitech wingman 2 --> x45 --> warthog. The wingman was awesome and a fun little stick. the x45 was terrible .. and the warthog is just freaking amazing. I don't know which joystick you may have tried... the t16000m has the same hall sensors as the warthog. It is a good stick to try if you are open to flying in this sim the way you are meant to experience it. WHISPR | Intel I7 5930K | Nvidia GTX980 4GB GDDR5 | 16GB DDR4 | Intel 730 series 512GB SSD | Thrustmaster WARTHOG | CH Pro Pedals | TrackIR4 pro | |A-10C|BS2 |CA|P-51 MUSTANG|UH-1H HUEY|MI-8 MTV2 |FC3|F5E|M2000C|AJS-37|FW190|BF 109K|Mig21|A-10:SSC,EWC|L-39|NEVADA| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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