Leatherneck SU-22 poll

A little inspirational picture for LN:

They do look good together, don't you think? :)

(Su-22 M4, Exercise STRONG RESOLVE, Powidz AFB, Poland 03.2002. Source Wacław Hołyś FB.)

Good FIND! LN hasnt any other choice ;).

highway to the kurwa zone

With A-10C and Viggen being completed as also other strikers planned A-7, A-6 (and probably some others) there is really a big need for an eastern bloc attack aircraft. Su-17/22 M3/M4 would really fit the role well. It doesn't matter who makes it (though LN for sure has the experience), the sooner then better.

highway to the kurwa zone

What do you mean by that? - I'm not asking about translation of "k" word... :music_whistling:

leatherneck -> swingwings -> f-14 -> top gun -> kenny loggins

except it's polish

I think it must be the perfect configuration for Leatherneck. ;)

One more, Kliniska Road Base 1996:

Hard to imagine a better fit for the Viggen. :)

Source: Wacław Hołyś FB album 'Szwedzi na DOLu Kliniska 1996r'.

i prefer an F-4 but we have almost no russian jets in DCS so now i prefer the 24 over the 17/22

i prefer an F-4 but we have almost no russian jets in DCS and it took place in a lot of wars as well (if we include the su-7 it was in more fights than almost any other jet)

The Su 7 is a completely different aircraft though.

But yea the Su-17/22 is a very combat proven aircraft that has seen service in all parts of the World (as well as seeing combat in many areas)

including most of the Warsaw pact nations and many many more in all the parts of the world (With Operators in Europe,The Middle east,Africa,South America and Asia).

So it would Suit a large number of different maps / Scenarios.

And its an aircraft i would very much love to see.

The Su 7 is a completely different aircraft though.

 

But yea the Su-17/22 is a very combat proven aircraft that has seen service in all parts of the World (as well as seeing combat in many areas)

including most of the Warsaw pact nations and many many more in all the parts of the world (With Operators in Europe,The Middle east,Africa,South America and Asia).

So it would Suit a large number of different maps / Scenarios.

 

And its an aircraft i would very much love to see.

Su-17 = su-7 with variable wings

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well, that's right.

lol

many guys forget this point.

youre just playing with words there, yes the su-17 concept was a hack of the su-7 but that's a heck of a significant change that it's not wrong to consider it a different airplane.

if you sold a su-17 module and delivered a su-7 instead and said "haha its basically the same thing" i dont think it would fly with anyone.

youre just playing with words there, yes the su-17 concept was a hack of the su-7 but that's a heck of a significant change that it's not wrong to consider it a different airplane.

 

if you sold a su-17 module and delivered a su-7 instead and said "haha its basically the same thing" i dont think it would fly with anyone.

Yea i,m not saying they are 1:1 copy but they are very comparable and the 17 was the solution for takeoffs and landings that was really bad in the 7 but much better because the variable wings

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With the AJS-37 Viggen available, being a fantastic strike aircraft, a Su17/22 would be the perfect equivalent for the red side of the Force. A SU17/22 from LN would be yet another dream come true.

With the AJS-37 Viggen available, being a fantastic strike aircraft, a Su17/22 would be the perfect equivalent for the red side of the Force. A SU17/22 from LN would be yet another dream come true.

i think Su24M would be better. larger payload, Longer Range, more advanced avionics.

even the later more definitive Su22M4 lacked a Air to ground radar.

Even then that still leaves US without a proper legacy strike aircraft.

i think Su24M would be better. larger payload, Longer Range, more advanced avionics.

 

even the later more definitive Su22M4 lacked a Air to ground radar.

 

Even then that still leaves US without a proper legacy strike aircraft.

After reading this i agree the 22 has lack of weapons but the 24 is the same but with kh 31 (anti ship) radar guided missile and a gun so i think F-4 with agm 12 agm 78 and aim 7e will be more interesting because we already have the su-25 that is pretty close in loadout

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I'd take an Su-17M4 over a Su-24M because it is a single seater and more agile. It's also more directly comparable to the Viggen. The Su-24 would be better paired with an F-111.

I'd take an Su-17M4 over a Su-24M because it is a single seater and more agile. It's also more directly comparable to the Viggen. The Su-24 would be better paired with an F-111.

But it has no radar :(

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After reading this i agree the 22 has lack of weapons but the 24 is the same but with kh 31 (anti ship) radar guided missile and a gun so i think F-4 with agm 12 agm 78 and aim 7e will be more interesting because we already have the su-25 that is pretty close in loadout

 

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F4 is very strike capable though its more of a fighter/bomber, not a dedicated Strike/Attack jet, Since it was designed as an interceptor initially, but ended up being versatile, and a multirole fighter for its day.

Apart from guided muntions such as agm12 bullpop , the definitive Phantom model like the F-4E, can actually use early Agm65A/B mavericks. ( which the viggen can too)

A very specifi Strike fighter bomber of the legacy era would either be the F105D Thundercheif, though that was being phased out of active duty in the mid 70s, or the F-111 which served into the 90s.

I'd take an Su-17M4 over a Su-24M because it is a single seater and more agile. It's also more directly comparable to the Viggen. The Su-24 would be better paired with an F-111.

Well to compare, The viggen doesnt Like High AOA, and only turns reasonably well when its very high on energy.I mean the Panavia Tornado GR1 despite its variable seeep wings, the pilots used similar tactics to the ones used for the Viggen in terms of weapons delivery ( Low n Fast strike, and Scoot back home). You dont need t have a nimble jet for it to be a great bomber.

There really is not exact counterpart to the viggen. but as pointed out the Su17/22 lacks ground radar. I think to have this more sophisciated strike aircraft, for US and Russia we need to look at aircraft with ground radars.

i think Su24M would be better. larger payload, Longer Range, more advanced avionics.

 

even the later more definitive Su22M4 lacked a Air to ground radar.

 

Even then that still leaves US without a proper legacy strike aircraft.

Well, no A2G radar makes it somewhat easier to create though, considering this has been a predominant point why many a/c were not to be approached by third-party developers.

Su-22 would also be more interesting because it was in service in many airforces around the world. Su-24 was and is flown only by a few, very few countries.

Well, no A2G radar makes it somewhat easier to create though, considering this has been a predominant point why many a/c were not to be approached by third-party developers.

 

Su-22 would also be more interesting because it was in service in many airforces around the world. Su-24 was and is flown only by a few, very few countries.

But Leatherneck can make Air to ground radar, without ED's help ( as evidence shows from thier work & release of the Viggen). Other 3rd parties are waiting for the in house solution ( F/A18C hornet release)

So it is very plausible for leatherneck to make another aircraft with a A2G radar.

I think SU24 is more interesting because it still fits into more modern scenarios. Its still in service today with country of origin.

I dont think widespread service is nessarily a reason to have an aircraft over another. otherwise by that logic ED would have went for an F-16 not an F/A18. Or how leatherneck Chose to work on the F14. Only used by USN and Iranian Airforce.

Then taking that into consideration it another reason to have the Su24. Iran is one of the users, so theyl have both an F14 and the Su24, along with the F5E. SInce they also use the Mig29 and had the Mirage F1 captured during the gulf war from fleeing pilots( a F1 variant is made by Aviodev) you've basically got the most of Iran's AIr force covered. Considering there is a Straight of Hormuz map in development , It therefore makes sense to include aircraft that also happen to be in use by Iran specifically.

Well to compare, The viggen doesnt Like High AOA, and only turns reasonably well when its very high on energy.I mean the Panavia Tornado GR1 despite its variable seeep wings, the pilots used similar tactics to the ones used for the Viggen in terms of weapons delivery ( Low n Fast strike, and Scoot back home). You dont need t have a nimble jet for it to be a great bomber.

 

 

 

There really is not exact counterpart to the viggen. but as pointed out the Su17/22 lacks ground radar. I think to have this more sophisciated strike aircraft, for US and Russia we need to look at aircraft with ground radars.

I don't consider terrain mapping radar terribly important in the context of DCS. So the Su-17's lack of it isn't a major issue to me. In terms of payload, the Su-17 is closer than the Su-24 is. Additionally, the Su-17M4 is already massively more capable than the Viggen, so it only seems fair to let the Viggen have something its opposition lacks.

In terms of usage, both have seen plenty of action, often fighting alongside each other. So no issues there to me.

I don't consider terrain mapping radar terribly important in the context of DCS. So the Su-17's lack of it isn't a major issue to me. In terms of payload, the Su-17 is closer than the Su-24 is. Additionally, the Su-17M4 is already massively more capable than the Viggen, so it only seems fair to let the Viggen have something its opposition lacks.

 

In terms of usage, both have seen plenty of action, often fighting alongside each other. So no issues there to me.

Viggens radar isn't just used for terrain mapping. It can reliably detect ships. The RB04 and Rb15 ati shipping missiles make use of the radar.

A2G radars can also be detect ground assets, which id say is nice for Situational Awareness. What also should be noted is that the Su22 ( even M4) lacks a HUD. ( Even the Viggen has a HUD). the Su17/22 M4 uses a the same gunsight as the initial Su25. Su24M offers a HUD for the Pilot.

also as noted by myself earlier the Su24 is better choice because:

 

it still fits into more modern scenarios. Its still in service today with country of origin.

 

 

Then taking that into consideration it another reason to have the Su24. Iran is one of the users, so theyl have both an F14 and the Su24, along with the F5E. SInce they also use the Mig29 and had the Mirage F1 captured during the gulf war from fleeing pilots( a F1 variant is made by Aviodev) you've basically got the most of Iran's AIr force covered. Considering there is a Straight of Hormuz map in development , It therefore makes sense to include aircraft that also happen to be in use by Iran specifically.

Su-17M4/Su-22M4 don't have the same gunsight like Su-25, it's only optical head taken ( VG-17 ) from whole ASP-17 set, but connected with on board digital computer what gave a lot new capabilites but still displays only targeting cross.

Su-24/Su-24M don't have HUD, at least hard to call this system a HUD, she displaying only two symbols from terrain avoiding system and in attack mode targeting cross, that's all. Only modernized variant like Su-24M2 and Gefest got real HUD's. Honestly lack of HUD isn't a real problem.

Is the mig-25 still classified?

Su-17M4/Su-22M4 don't have the same gunsight like Su-25, it's only optical head taken ( VG-17 ) from whole ASP-17 set, but connected with on board digital computer what gave a lot new capabilites but still displays only targeting cross.

Su-24/Su-24M don't have HUD, at least hard to call this system a HUD, she displaying only two symbols from terrain avoiding system and in attack mode targeting cross, that's all. Only modernized variant like Su-24M2 and Gefest got real HUD's. Honestly lack of HUD isn't a real problem.

right if the Su24M's display inst a a real HUD, than that goes double for the Viggen. It has nothing to do with Problems Its just about having something that is Suited for greater amount of Scenarios ( su24 would Fits both into coldwar ,and even into present day scenarios, including fitting into good ol Cacasus Map, since the Su24 also use in the 2008 Russo- Georgian war)

 

it still fits into more modern scenarios. Its still in service today with country of origin.

 

 

Then taking that into consideration it another reason to have the Su24. Iran is one of the users, so theyl have both an F14 and the Su24, along with the F5E. SInce they also use the Mig29 and had the Mirage F1 captured during the gulf war from fleeing pilots( a F1 variant is made by Aviodev) you've basically got the most of Iran's AIr force covered. Considering there is a Straight of Hormuz map in development , It therefore makes sense to include aircraft that also happen to be in use by Iran specifically.