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Is it technically possible to make base textures better?


Gierasimov

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Looking at this example, is it technically possible to use once tile of detailed texture instead of this unaligned mix of random texture patches to represent urban areas?

 

I am not talking about improving current maps, I am thinking of the future projects, many times it was mentioned that the size would be an issue, but I don't regard this as a valid reason as this can be scaled via options as we do with other aspects of rendering and also hardware is available.

 

It does even look not so great from the altitude so the benefit to those flying up in the air as well as mud movers and rotor heads could be significant.

 

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Looking at this example, is it technically possible to use once tile of detailed texture instead of this unaligned mix of random texture patches to represent urban areas?

 

I am not talking about improving current maps, I am thinking of the future projects, many times it was mentioned that the size would be an issue, but I don't regard this as a valid reason as this can be scaled via options as we do with other aspects of rendering and also hardware is available.

 

It does even look not so great from the altitude so the benefit to those flying up in the air as well as mud movers and rotor heads could be significant.

 

 

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Well, there goes the neighborhood.. yikes literally! lol

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Looking at this example, is it technically possible to use once tile of detailed texture instead of this unaligned mix of random texture patches to represent urban areas?
:huh: That looks more like some tilling error or textures bug. I think you'll be better saying coordinates of the place and posting a bug report.

 

 

S!

"I went into the British Army believing that if you want peace you must prepare for war. I believe now that if you prepare for war, you get war."

-- Major-General Frederick B. Maurice

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Not really, its pretty much most of the places. It's not a bug, it's the feature...

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That is the base texture, before any blending etc.

 

But IMHO the DCS terrain is still a very rough and empty. And what it's requiring is simply random generated ground clutter, a far more scattered forests, trees etc.

As when today Caucasus is like billiard table with few big forests here and there.

 

And what I mean by random generated ground clutter and terrain, is that mapper use a brush that randomly place trees, rocks, bushes etc on area that is painted. No individual placing than in cities and towns.

 

And then simply more advanced terrain engine with graphics engine that will change the visual objects amount and level based the camera speed and altitude. So if you fly high, all your visuals are blended more. A high magnification optics will render only that proportion at high objects count.

 

Replay etc where time is slowed or paused to take screenshots would render all at max detail.

 

This would mean that low flying helicopter at slow speed gets all maximum, while medium level high speed jet does get rougher blending.

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Examples include detailed map boundaries as well.

 

Correct, it is from ME but still in the game is not much better. Initially, I thought it was due to the detailed area boundaries but no. Even Bandar Abbas and Khasab look like unfinished - some examples:

 

y4mbggTjgB0l3xk1nss8vGIzsfP2MTRXRXGen8nvkJl1DhdOWhl6eqFVipMq-8d9NRGBB7saavQmb0ThyAfsJGIqysMFOw83ft07cqnlI-IMkNjcyNqn6GQoTBZT086-K9ylLNmy2OJsdifyO59-aMK-pxjNxt0QCNGcN_JFQ5oz5nmPCSImRXdyEmMik2oXo5yP9AnL19dfzOiiaXHxAfxug?width=2339&height=1589&cropmode=none

 

Bandar Abbas

 

y4mNWpG3fDceJxzuXwkfyUIKrMA0NLr4rX1u0kin9XTaz9RBT7OnadP6WDol73M7uuJBpm6eboRElUX64li6n_YNABRG1hYVZS8miSObfnGjcys7Nt28CkSeO9scaij_u5cbf1BxJ5VrOqxZvFQZqBNtN4zluxgCLgIdtNDRtMvb1DPJpAS4MJmYaKHhNTEGQbuG3VjJXKuYtYwP6PtFDBIkw?width=1937&height=1755&cropmode=none

 

Khasab

 

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Just examples of how textures do not blend.

 

As I said, I am not treating this as a bug. It is what it is, but I wish future maps could be closer to what we see in Caucasus map where the base texture layer blends with detailed textures in a nicer way.

 

Looking at Syria map work in progress screenshots makes me think they don't have this problem, or at least that's how it looks.

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Correct

 

Pfff yeah is not perfect. What is? There are worse things.

 

They are, absolutely. This thread, however, is not about "worse things", it is specifically about DCS maps and texture alignment quality.

 

I can say, even more, the aim was to get technical remarks from a member of the ED team and not necesairy from the community.

 

Thanks for stopping by though.

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If someone is pointing out something that he/she does not like, and this something is measurable and unbiased and demonstrated with images, I don't see why someone else feel the need to jump in the thread and shout "to me it's ok!".

 

Can't you see how non-constructive this attitude is?

 

It's like Gierasimov or other community members have no rights to express their opinion (expressed in a very polite and constructive manner, by the way).

 

This attitude is rude, gentlemen. Feel free to read and pass by if something don't bother you.

 

Sorry for the OT.

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Makes me not wanna buy the PG.

 

Unbelievable some people think it looks OK. It doesn't. Those shots look absolutely terrible. ED might wanna consider changing the way they build maps. I wish the maps were more photoreal. It would add a ton of immersion for sure.

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Makes me not wanna buy the PG.

 

Unbelievable some people think it looks OK. It doesn't. Those shots look absolutely terrible. ED might wanna consider changing the way they build maps. I wish the maps were more photoreal. It would add a ton of immersion for sure.

Ironically, I haven't seen those places in the pics, and yes, it looks good, it looks gorgeous indeed.

 

S!

"I went into the British Army believing that if you want peace you must prepare for war. I believe now that if you prepare for war, you get war."

-- Major-General Frederick B. Maurice

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Yeah, so this is why I have asked, basically if it is a technical limitation.

Sure, there are places where it looks really nice, and to me, PG map is the best one so far, it's actually the one I use 99% of the time.

 

When you start building missions with ground targets involved, you will start noticing more examples.

 

@ OttoPus - thank you very much for your kind words.

@ davidtsw - I don't agree with the statements but I share the same wish.

@ Ala13_ManOWar - I have seen many places, even around Dubai, where roads are not aligned and elevation mesh is weird around bridges, intersections, or just roads, however, at 600 KIAS I don't register them too much...

 

Overall the best map so far - my opinion.

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Actually Khasab1.png shows weird intersection next to car. Granted it is not as bad as my examples.

If you try my provided coordinates you will see. Also it is more visible from the top angle it seems.

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OK so I checked your coordinates. One is a field in Bandar Abbas, The other is Sirjan which is way up in Iran in a low fidelity area of the map, not in Kasab as you had labeled the screenshot and coordinates. At first glance it appears to be poorly modeled. Until you look at a satellite image in google earth. Then you realize that it looks very close to real life. In fact if they changed it once could argue that they would be trying to make it better than real life images.

509200686_BandarAbbasME.thumb.png.b951e8708ce88a3051d66d4dc8368b26.png

2122854972_BandarAbbasGE.thumb.JPG.41938a837315bb02271d7a4efc4ee6bd.JPG

153113068_SirjanME.thumb.png.6f4535f112bd882194b3b6c78f6df63a.png

28115467_SirjanGE.thumb.JPG.d63ab0e9016750da7a6743e4670f828d.JPG

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To the contrary...

 

OK so I checked your coordinates. One is a field in Bandar Abbas, The other is Sirjan which is way up in Iran in a low fidelity area of the map, not in Kasab as you had labeled the screenshot and coordinates. At first glance it appears to be poorly modeled. Until you look at a satellite image in google earth. Then you realize that it looks very close to real life. In fact if they changed it once could argue that they would be trying to make it better than real life images.

 

First, and foremost, thank you for your effort. I really appreciate this.

I did check Google Earth, and I know that the first screen is from Sirjan, as well as I know it is the lower quality region of our map. However, this does not explain random tiles that don't add up and are generally lighter than underlying sand texture which makes too much contrast. How about that highway or local roads that are simply cut?

 

Now, the second picture is Bandar Abbas - so this is supposed to be higher fidelity region. That green field should not be alone, even when compared to satellite imagery.

 

The third image is Khasab and there is no question about that.

 

https://earth.google.com/web/@26.19472194,56.25777368,11.72119445a,1000.66494653d,35y,-94.01303292h,44.94682033t,0r/data=CjsaORIxCgAZH85oUNkxOkAhQlHq3P4gTEAqGzI2wrAxMSc0MS4wIk4gNTbCsDE1JzI4LjAiRRgCIAEoAg


Edited by Gierasimov
coords

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I get you are saying. My personal conclusion is that they got it really close to real life. As close as they could while still maintaining a playable graphics load for the most people possible. I think that if they would have gotten more detail, and fixed all the shading and alignment issues, it would overwhelm a lot of folks systems. Maybe this is a balance struck between the two?

 

I know that I have a decent system and I can fly helicopters through the skyscrapers in downtown Dubai and abu Dabi at 200 ft. And still get around 50 FPS with everything set at Ultra using 2 monitors. And you probably have a system giving similar results. But a lot of people are not fortunate enough to have a system like that and I think ED does a good job trying to make it playable for those folks. Maybe with Vulcan someday, the new maps wont have to compromise. This will make high resolution high frame rate more available to more people. A RX 580 8GB would be enough on Vulcan. I know with my RX5700 I get fur mark to bench at around 60 FPS on DX and like 140 on Vulcan. It will be a great day if they go to this. A RX 580 and a I7 9700K is all you would need to push 1480P.

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There's no point in making excuses. Gierasimov's examples are valid. In short the answer is: No, there is no technical limitation to make it better. Only the money is. Imho they should at least connect the roads and blend the textures a bit in lower fidelity areas. Fixing it certainly wouldn't hit the performance. They agreed on some quality level and should make it consistent in all places.

 

With all that said buying the map you should take it as is. Nobody claims it is done 1:1 with the real images. If you think it's a bug just report one in the right subforum.

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With all that said buying the map you should take it as is. Nobody claims it is done 1:1 with the real images. If you think it's a bug just report one in the right subforum

 

As I said already, this isn't a bug to me, but rather compromise of resources vs. quality, if any other section, it would be in the wishlist.

 

I also don't expect this to be fixed, I would simply enjoy the next map benefiting from better blending of map layers.

 

Thanks for all of your input!

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No, that's not a bug, it's a request for better graphics quality outside the detailed area which are the limits to make it playable for the majority, so that's related to performances.

 

And yes, that's for the wishlist section, not bugs section unless you find a real bug.

 

S!

"I went into the British Army believing that if you want peace you must prepare for war. I believe now that if you prepare for war, you get war."

-- Major-General Frederick B. Maurice

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More like asking for technical EDGE insight. I would not call Bandar Abbas or Khasab outside of detailed area. That's not the point anyway.

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