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Why is it So hard to land the MI 8


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No, I mean the controller assignments and possible axis curves you may have put in. You sure those haven't been mangled for any reason?

I did try to delete the controller profile and after I tryed to fly with default input (no button or axis change) and still having problem. Guess it must be me then…

But thanks for the help anyway :thumbup:

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Yeah it takes a bit to get the Mi-8 keep at it it a very rewarding helicopter to fly. Happy to jump online in MP if that's doable. :thumbup:

Control is an illusion which usually shatters at the least expected moment.

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I did try to delete the controller profile and after I tryed to fly with default input (no button or axis change) and still having problem. Guess it must be me then…

But thanks for the help anyway

 

He didn't mean you to only delete it. DCS is notoriously bad at assigning axis automatically. After recreation, go into axis assignments and make sure it hasn't come up with some strange settings, conflicts if you have several controllers connected. Don't bother about the buttons.

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No matter how slow I take it, when it comes to a certain points the whole helicopter begin to shake and it's only down from there. Even if I try to give it some throttle again when the shaking begins. I use a Saitec X52 Pro, but as I wrote earlyer, I never had so big problem with it before.

 

 

You meant a bit more collective when it starts to shake, not throttle, right? Or did we just find the reason for your VRS? :smartass:

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I have also tryed differents settings in the "spesial options" without any changes. What is the best settings here (see Picture)

I use a Saitek X52 Pro

 

 

I don't think a curve change would solve your problem to be honest. From what you wrote, you simply need to add more collective as soon as you see your VSI starts going down. Shaking is a sign of coming out of transitional lift, which means you need to add more collective to keep the VSI from decreasing beyond controllable.

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get into a stationary hover and note the degrees of blade pitch needed to maintain it.

 

because this is the amount you have to have to hover.

 

so when coming to a stop and the vibrations start, raise the collective till you have the same blade pitch on the blade pitch indicator.

 

if the rotor starts to slow down and the generators fail then you raised the collective too quickly.

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get into a stationary hover and note the degrees of blade pitch needed to maintain it.

 

because this is the amount you have to have to hover.

 

so when coming to a stop and the vibrations start, raise the collective till you have the same blade pitch on the blade pitch indicator.

 

if the rotor starts to slow down and the generators fail then you raised the collective too quickly.

 

 

The blade angle that holds you in sationary hover in ground effect will probably not be enough to stop your decent out of ground effect. Just my 2 cent.

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Hi Tusler,

All previous posts are superb and I will only reinforce some points.

 

As you slow down the knocking vibration is not VRS! This is an aerodynamic vibration caused by the airframe/rotors once a certain speed is achieved. It is however a very useful vibration that warns you that loss of lift is coming and the VVI (VSI) must be glanced at more often as a danger zone is approaching.

How fast it is approaching depends on how fast you are decelerating.

 

In regards to your warthog, reduce the friction on the throttle, the Warthog is extremely capable of tiny small adjustments. A high friction causes jumps in collective adjustments due to stickation.

 

Set the zoom view to the Thrustmaster's throttles analogue "friction controller". A wide open view is essential for bringing this girl in to land. I reckon the Zoom function is the most useful analogue axis in sim chopper flight (using a standard monitor). During landing... or as you line up for landing, zoom out to ensure that you can see the Doppler drift and VVI below it. The zoomed out view should allow an eye ball glance on the VVI as your work load increases.

 

Know your VVI (VSI). Once you zoom out you will not be able to read your VVI hash marks. learn the hash points by heart and where they are. Once you know the VVI, even when zoomed out, you will see where the pointer dial is pointing or going. With experience you will ride the dial down.


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  • 3 weeks later...

I'd recommend two different types of missions for learning how to shoot approaches in the Mi-8.

 

1 - DLQ. Set two ships up parallel to each other, about a half mile apart on the same heading. Go back and forth landing correctly (come to hover on the left side, slip right and land).

 

2 - CSAR missions. Set a mission up with the CSAR script and have a bunch of planes over top of a huge bunch of red SAMs. Remove the SAMs after a certain time. Enough time to let them shoot the planes down.

 

Going around and picking up the pilots gave me a really good understanding of how approaches need to be planned and executed, and especially how you need to handle power as you come out of ETL.

 

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I prefered flying the Mi-8 in "easy flight mode" and I could have a good time for hours with it...picking up soldiers on the montains...cargo...etc...

After I bought the F-18 I have selected to fly in "Sim mode" because there is no way to fly it in easy flight mode. That is not a problem for me. The F-18 is easy to fly and use. But I find it too hard to land and controll the Mi-8. Of cause I can change the options in the game for each time I change from plane to helicopter but with an endless lodingtime after restart, I simply dont have the spirit to do it.

In other Words, if I play with my friend that only want/can play in easy flight mode, I can use the Mi-8, but then I have to forget about using the F-18. Some options that work fine with certain planes/helicopter dont work with others.

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I'm just getting to grips with it. I've had the module for a long time but spent most of my time in warbirds

 

 

For me the difficulties were/are you need to have everything going at once, Stick back for instance means collective down to maintain a given height,collective down results in having to reduce right rudder. When you are pinned to the VSI and having constant stick movement that's hard until "muscle memory" starts to kick in.

 

 

Next is the ridiculously low sink rate to prevent VRS, you can recover from VRS at onset by applying more collective, but you must be quick.

 

 

Apart from that the inertia of the large mass means make an input and wait, it will respond but not immediately, ignore that and you will be like a ballerina on speed and quickly get into the realms of PIO. Cyclic, Collective and Rudder all need to measured, usually small, and smooth

 

 

 

I'm so glad I revisited this module it is just enormous fun and so so different from fixed wing. Waiting for the sale and thinking now about the Huey.

 

 

Helos are tremendously satisfying but take a lot of practice, stick with it because when it just starts to gel you'll be laughing like a drain

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the ridiculously low sink rate to prevent VRS
As it comes to the Mi-8, if you get slow and your AoA is high, you'll get into VRS much easier than if you were level(ish) - or that's my experience at any rate. So try and slow down as early as possible and then level off before hovering/descending, and it's all much easier I've found.

 

That said, you'll still need a proper collective-cyclic-rudder coordination going, or you won't be able to control the chopper in its various flight phases. So above all practice, practice and practice, and then practice some more ;)

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  • 1 month later...

I'm not good by any definition but I found if I just commit to full down/off collective while slowly descending works better for me. Also add turning and I can see my landing spot easier. I also start my APU while approaching in case VRS and I end up having no choice but full collective and generators fail.

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Something that no-one has mentioned at all so far, and that's the importance of approaching into wind. It will make your life so much easier if you do this.

 

In terms of VRS, it requires 3 things to occur; avoid one and you're safe:

 

  • Low forward airspeed
  • Rate of descent
  • Power applied

 

The easiest way to achieve this is to make shallow approaches (as if you're flying fixed wing) and aim to ensure your speed doesn't drop below 50kmh or so until you're within ground effect, then come to the hover.

 

I do not agree with watching the VSI, it's not a good technique. Concentrate on maintaining a nice shallow approach angle and managing your speed, and your vertical speed will take care of itself.

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^ making vertical landings is a sucker's game. you can actually come in fast in ground effect with a slightly elevated nose at low collective, stop and land at the same time. minimizes time of vulnerability and gets you on the ground faster.

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It is heavy stuff, not a Gazelle. Flying is not so easy. You need to have patience and predict many things. Experience is the key.

 

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^ making vertical landings is a sucker's game. you can actually come in fast in ground effect with a slightly elevated nose at low collective, stop and land at the same time. minimizes time of vulnerability and gets you on the ground faster.

 

As long as you don't have to, lets say, clear an obstacle right in front of the LZ. At some point you're going to have to deal with hovering out of ground effect. But it's true that there's no point in making every landing a vertical descent from 200m.

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To be a good Mi-8 pilot you need to be versed in multiple types of approach profiles. Steep approach, pinnacle landings, low approach, quick stops (don't let the word quick fool you), high altitude/high gross weight etc. Use that vibration to your advantage. We called it "the burble" and it is an excellent indicator that you are going through translift. You can make any angle approach you want as long as you can ride the burble to the ground.

 

Same with takeoffs and transition maneuvers. Try hover maneuvers where you start in a stable hover then slide left or right while doing a pedal turn. Complete a 360* turn then reverse it. Pick a point on the ground like a taxi light and pedal turn the nose around it. Then the main gearbox. Then the tail.

 

This airframe takes a long time to master but I'll say it has a lot in common with other heavy helos like the 53.

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