FW190D9 can't dogfight.

Donald Caldwell is not the most trustworthy of sources...

 

 

 

He has presented a lot of misinformation disputed by other books and actual 190 pilots. Like for example that the A8 turned better than the D9, where'as in reality the reverse is true, the D9 being both lighter, less draggy and more powerful engine wise.

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I was quoting iFox.. In any case, P51 is draggier than Dora at high speeds. The parasitic drag (form, skin and interference drag) increases with the square of speed. What P51 is doing in DCS has nothing to do with reality.

 

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Pls define high speeds, 360mph at SL high speed or not high speed yet ?

Pls look at this, completely closed coolant radiators doesn't provide top speed in P-51 in those tests, but in DCS looks like fully closed give speed.

I did some tests already, seems that temp is spot on, when i close radiators coolant temp go sky high, but speed keep increasing instead of droping.

So if radiator shutters are calibrated correctly, manual changing them will lead only to worse performance, unlike in DCS.

I am very concerned about this right now.

I was quoting iFox.. In any case, P51 is draggier than Dora at high speeds. The parasitic drag (form, skin and interference drag) increases with the square of speed. What P51 is doing in DCS has nothing to do with reality.

 

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Erm, it can't be draggier as it's achieving the same speeds ingame with less HP and a larger surface area.

I can achieve 326 KTAS at SL with the Mustang, and 325 KTAS with the D9.

I was quoting iFox.. In any case, P51 is draggier than Dora at high speeds. The parasitic drag (form, skin and interference drag) increases with the square of speed. What P51 is doing in DCS has nothing to do with reality.

 

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Erm, it can't be draggier as it's achieving the same speeds ingame with less HP and a larger surface area.

I can achieve 326 KTAS at SL with the Mustang, and 325 KTAS with the D9.

Erm, it can't be draggier as it's achieving the same speeds ingame with less HP and a larger surface area.

 

I can achieve 326 KTAS at SL with the Mustang, and 325 KTAS with the D9.

How can you do it? i can make something around 315kts.

I agree with you, look at cross section of the p-51 it is tiny plane, + it has laminar air flow wings, which supposed to lower the drag at high speeds+ it has additional thrust provided by oil/coolant scoop.

How can you do it? i can make something around 315kts.

I agree with you, look at cross section of the p-51 it is tiny plane, + it has laminar air flow wings, which supposed to lower the drag at high speeds+ it has additional thrust provided by oil/coolant scoop.

Laminar flow is just.. in theory. In practice you cannot achieve it, it's more like a holy grail in aerodynamics. The degree of cross section changes is what matters, and P51 is the worst..

:thumbup:

Dora don't have Meredith effect in cooling system.

Any way D-9 needs enormous amount of power for speed compare to k-4 and p-51

And p-51 has low parasitic drag, mustang has problem with induced drag.

Dora don't have Meredith effect in cooling system.

Any way D-9 needs enormous amount of power for speed compare to k-4 and p-51

And p-51 has low parasitic drag, mustang has problem with induced drag.

That's not proven.. even today. If you've heard about Strega Air Racer then you should know they're using modern type cooling for their P51, with different ducts and longer scoops and actually that's a well kept secret. On the other hand the Meredith effect it's based on some assumptions that we know today that they are not quite valid.

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That's not proven.. even today. If you've heard about Strega Air Racer then you should know they're using modern type cooling for their P51, with different ducts and longer scoops and actually that's a well kept secret. On the other hand the Meredith effect it's based on some assumptions that we know today that they are not quite valid.

 

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I know they do, but no one said that cooling from P-51D is perfect.

ofc the p-51 dont have laminar air flow wings,but they do provide low drag at high speeds, as far as i know Reno racers don't change wings airfoils in their race p-51, that must mean something :)

How can you do it? i can make something around 315kts.

I agree with you, look at cross section of the p-51 it is tiny plane, + it has laminar air flow wings, which supposed to lower the drag at high speeds+ it has additional thrust provided by oil/coolant scoop.

67" Hg, 2700-2800 rpm.

You forgot to mention that wing area of P-51 is much more than Dora has, that makes overall drag closer to Dora. And Dora has significantly more power (thought power is only in 1/3 power relative to the speed).

Welcome back, I haven't seen your posts for quite time. It could be that i missed some.

So what is making that Dora's top speed is about the same, when D-9 has more power.

Does drora's prop play role here?

You forgot to mention that wing area of P-51 is much more than Dora has, that makes overall drag closer to Dora. And Dora has significantly more power (thought power is only in 1/3 power relative to the speed).

What makes the P51 draggier at high speeds is the sudden change of shape in cross section due to those radiators. The smoother this change is the less parasitic drag it has, just like Dora. And btw, the wetted surface of Dora's wings is.. elliptical. We don't want to start the Clmax discussion again.. don't we? :)

Hi everybody …

Recently got into ww2 props, and now I hardly fly much else. Dora is my favourite. I've heard whilst flying and watching youtube videos, other peoples ideas on how the planes should perform and how you should deploy it. So I have been trying to fly using the hit and run tactics on the storm of war server.

I have noted that if I run in and engage a bandit and egress straight out, without making hardly any turns and full throttle mw50 etc, a circling P51 will be able to catch up with me. I debated adding a climb to my speedy egress, however I was not confident I would lose the stang!

I also noted when going out to sea on a long constant gradual climb to high altitude to intercept bombers, I turned around to see a P51 sat point blank behind me. He clearly had been there a while, noting I hadn't seen him due to no rear mirror, and was lining his guns up to shoot me down just before I engaged the bomber. He shot me down no worries lol. I had my engine pretty much maxed, and he was living his best life trolling me haha.

I love the dora, but am not sure how best to deploy it now. Could probably do with flying with other dora pilots to be fair.

you need to be flying a me262 to achieve the sort of raw performance disparity that allows you to just walk away from a guy like you're expecting.

if you want to abuse your advantages, well... don't do anything the other guy can do too! any airplane can do a nice relaxing climb. now if you zoom climb, you'll peter out after a couple thousand feet, but do you think the p-51 will be able to do a circle and then also have the energy reserve to zoom up to the same height? all of a sudden you've done something he can't do.

you need to be flying a me262 to achieve the sort of raw performance disparity that allows you to just walk away from a guy like you're expecting.

 

if you want to abuse your advantages, well... don't do anything the other guy can do too! any airplane can do a nice relaxing climb. now if you zoom climb, you'll peter out after a couple thousand feet, but do you think the p-51 will be able to do a circle and then also have the energy reserve to zoom up to the same height? all of a sudden you've done something he can't do.

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Hi everybody …

Recently got into ww2 props, and now I hardly fly much else. Dora is my favourite. I've heard whilst flying and watching youtube videos, other peoples ideas on how the planes should perform and how you should deploy it. So I have been trying to fly using the hit and run tactics on the storm of war server.

 

I have noted that if I run in and engage a bandit and egress straight out, without making hardly any turns and full throttle mw50 etc, a circling P51 will be able to catch up with me. I debated adding a climb to my speedy egress, however I was not confident I would lose the stang!

I also noted when going out to sea on a long constant gradual climb to high altitude to intercept bombers, I turned around to see a P51 sat point blank behind me. He clearly had been there a while, noting I hadn't seen him due to no rear mirror, and was lining his guns up to shoot me down just before I engaged the bomber. He shot me down no worries lol. I had my engine pretty much maxed, and he was living his best life trolling me haha.

I love the dora, but am not sure how best to deploy it now. Could probably do with flying with other dora pilots to be fair.

Storm of War server has MW50 disabled. So the germans are badly outclassed on that server. The P51D with WEP is about the same speed as the Dora with WEP on the deck at the moment. The Dora used to be the fastest but is slower by about 12 knots after one of the recent updates.

Storm of War server has MW50 disabled. So the germans are badly outclassed on that server. The P51D with WEP is about the same speed as the Dora with WEP on the deck at the moment. The Dora used to be the fastest but is slower by about 12 knots after one of the recent updates.

Someone finally disabled MW50 in multiplayer? I will have to give that a try. Should have been done for the 109 only though, not the 190.

Someone finally disabled MW50 in multiplayer? I will have to give that a try. Should have been done for the 109 only though, not the 190.

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For balance and historical compromise.

The maps and planeset are one big anachronism.

Considering the D-9 shouldn't even be seen over Normandy in 1944 it's a sop to D-9 owners who don't own the A-8 to allow them to fly on the server whilst attempting to maintain some historical levels of performance.

Be assured as soon as a map module is available where Bf 109K-4s and Fw 190D-9s operated historically with MW50 I have no doubt that the server admin will create and host missions that these features are fully enabled on.

as soon as a map module is available

Someone finally disabled MW50 in multiplayer? I will have to give that a try. Should have been done for the 109 only though, not the 190.

Yeah, god forbid having to earn your victories by out flying your opponent.