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SA-5 : Any updates?


nighthawk2174

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In a recent weekend new post we saw WIP images of the SA5 ED is working on. I was just curious as to how much modeling is going to go into this?

 

For example this is the what I've been able to find on it so far

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5V28 V-880

5V28E V-880E (export varient)

range:

 

 

04Uq0zG.jpg

5V21-Gammon-Cutaway-1AS.jpg

 

 

1- 5G22/5G23/5G24 CW semi-active homing radar seeker

2- 5A43 inertial autopilot

3- 5E24/5E50 two channel radio proximity fuse

4- 5E23 computer

5- 5B73 self destruct mechanism

6- 5B14Sh 217 kg blast fragmentation warhead [37,000 fragments]

7- Onboard power supply TG-02 propellant tank

8- AK-27P oxidiser1 melange 1680 kg tank

9- compressed air tank [pressurises propellant tanks]

10- PRD-81/5S25/5S28 solid propellant booster using RAM-10K filler with 3-5 sec burn duration

11- TG-02 586 kg propellant tank

12- 5I43/5I47 65 SHP turbine onboard power supply2

13- Onboard power supply AK-27P oxidiser tank

14- hydraulic system tank

15- 5D12/5D67 liquid propellant sustainer powerplant with programmable thrust profiles

16- aerodynamic controls with hydraulic actuators

 

 

 

S-200VE-Engagement-Envelope-F.pdf

 

Notes:

 

"BIP - sufficient fuel for ~200 sec operation of avionics, hydraulics and turbopumps; typical missile midcourse cruise at 1,400 m/s"

Boost Rockets:

 

Burn time: 4sec

Thrust: 1500kN|

HEAVY SMOKE"

 

Sustain Motor:

Burn time: 44~100sec | depends on program

Thrust: 32~100kN | depends on program

Fuel Mass: 2266kg |

Thrust builds up slowly after engine start at M1.2

*Smokless"

 

Guidance profiles

m3l5FFv.jpg

 

Low thrust for targets under 80km. Uses Pn guidance and lowest thrust settings to keep thermal heating of the missile body within limits.

 

High thrust for targets over 80km. Uses a loft profile which is 48° for 30 sec with PN after burnout.

 

Site layout:

mr5ESVl.jpg

 

Radar:

Targeting Radar 5N62 Square Pair:

Square-Pair-K-1M_Hungary_Kecel_MiroslavGyurosi-1S.jpg

 

 

 

5N62-Square-Pair-K1V-Drawing-2S.jpg

1-KA-141M transmit antenna

2-KA-152 receive antenna feed

3-KA-151M receive antenna

4-Support frame

5-KA-17M missile uplink/downlink antenna

6-Amplifier

7-Rotational drive component

8-Rotational drive component

9-KA-10V cabin

10-Antenna emulator

11-Support frame

12-KA-142MT transmit antenna feed

13-Spillover screen

 

 

 

Search Radar 5N84AE Tall King C:

5N84A-Big-Back-1S.jpg

often with

PRV-17 Odd Pair

PRV-17-Odd-Pair-1S.jpg

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I on the other hand am wondering how much was actually completed so far.

As always, coding flight model for the missile would be the most challenging, I wonder if it is close to be considered complete at all.

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I so want this missile in DCS.

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I so want this missile in DCS.

 

 

I fear it will only be useful if logically working together in a network. Launching at max range is a waste of resources. I put high hopes on EDs plans for SAM overhaul.

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I fear it will only be useful if logically working together in a network. Launching at max range is a waste of resources. I put high hopes on EDs plans for SAM overhaul.

 

Don't give up those hopes! From the same news letter :D

 

In parallel to this effort, we are also designing support for Integrated Air Defense System (IADS) networks and more advanced air defence AI to include shared-time searches, counter-SEAD/DEAD tactics, and SAM traps. Together, DCS will provide the most realistic and challenging air defence simulation to operate in.
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No you will not get the behind enemy lines timid shotgun missile.

AWAITING ED NEW DAMAGE MODEL IMPLEMENTATION FOR WW2 BIRDS

 

Fat T is above, thin T is below. Long T is faster, Short T is slower. Open triangle is AWACS, closed triangle is your own sensors. Double dash is friendly, Single dash is enemy. Circle is friendly. Strobe is jammer. Strobe to dash is under 35 km. HDD is 7 times range key. Radar to 160 km, IRST to 10 km. Stay low, but never slow.

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Don't give up those hopes! From the same news letter :D

 

That's what i was refering to :D

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  • 2 months later...
  • 1 month later...

Because the chinese stuff is not made by ED, but by Deka Ironwork Simulations.

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DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

Tornado3 small.jpg

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SCUD needs ballistic missile flight model, which will be worked on, as per Wags, once the Viper flight model is done. I don't think two years would be needed here.

SA-5 - I believe this would be similar to the above, with main focus on flight model, guidance and destruction coding.

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to be honest i wish they would stop doing such highly detailed texture models.

 

 

look at the truck they teased in the weekly update a while ago. I mean, no kidding really pretty, perfectly modeled seams in the tarp over the back, high res license plate, beautiful reflection mapping and all this stuff.. none of which you will ever see even at 150ft going over the thing in a helicopter, the slowest and lowest type of thing you will ever fly by in one.

 

 

just give us a basic looking model that performs pretty close and do it inside 3 months, the game is in dire need of units and if it takes years to put in a single SAM system we're actually behind the event horizon.

 

 

there are going to be new SAMs coming out in real life faster than old SAMs are being added to the game, it's silly. We're still missing huge chunks of the order of battle of almost everything, guys, come on.

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Sa-5 3D models has into DCS World 2.5.5.....

 

On a air / land / sea simulator, you need build high quality 3D models for all and update the all old 3D models, that take time. Remember, the list has very extensive and someone "claim" about add more and more units, ED and other 3rd parties has making progress about them. (check my signature......)

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Cik said:
...

Meh I use the F6 and F7 camera a lot, so visuals have some level of importance for me. Plus I do like using CA directly so to speak.

I do wholeheartedly agree with you on needing more units, but for me I think it's more important to update legacy and older units to the same high standard before adding new. Though to my knowledge it seems like doing the artwork for xxxx unit is probably the thing that is the least time consuming, I can't imagine it being much longer than say a week for something like a missile, though I could very easily be mistaken plus the SA-5 models themselves are already in DCS, it's just not implemented if that makes sense. The 3D models exist and from what I can gather are near enough done you just need to use the modelviewer to see them, see SilverDragon's video.

Their team is stretched thin, the 3D work is looks as though it's already pretty much complete apart from maybe a launcher (as it's not in the modelviewer just yet (?)) and I guess it's not the main priority, given the Hornet etc. I'm betting the FM for this system is going to be the most difficult aspect.

And I'll take quality over quantity any day of the week, it's basically the point of DCS and for me good looking assets > mass produced bad looking assets. Though mileage may vary, I can only speak from personal experience - I use the F2, F6, F7 and Ctrl+F11 cameras a lot and I definitely notice the difference, not to mention looking at what's hanging off the wing in cockpit.

I'd be willing to pay for new upgrades to old units as I know ED don't make anything by updating old models.


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Take acount meanwhile a 3D modeler need build a 3D model, build animations, damage zones, damage models, texturize and others, and maintain them update when the DCS engine make a improve or change, That is only a little part to add them to DCS World. Search a codder to build all lua files, a FM specialist to add a propper flight model if has a weapon, aircraft or helo. Other person to add them to ED main engine and databases, and more to other funtionality if not require to the ED team to build no existant funtionality as examples, missile balistic flight profile, torpedoes underwater, implement realistic armour and a long etc on the To Do list to DCS....

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I think they have some main problems with this implementation.

 

The Range for S-200 missiles in comparison with more modern S-300 range in current game play ( they are forced to increase range for current S-300 as this last have more range IRL than in current game ).

 

Because the above mentioned. The game play will be OP and the Bluefor fighters will be forced to low level altitude approaches and this is hard task when you add Redfor units for CAP this SAM area.

 

They are IRL fixed LN with long time rearming, at the next level S-300 is supposed to be a mobile SAM as this is his major advantage respect S-200. Amazingly our S-300 remain forever as no mobile SAM in current game, killing the major difference advantages respect S-200.

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Kind of agree with earlier posters who would opt for more simplified models. The stuff we're getting looks incredible but if it's taking six months to build a new model of a truck, we can forget about badly needed new units being added to the sim. Maybe this is something the community can eventually help out with.

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I disagree. More quality units are great, granted it takes more resources to create but I am willing to wait rather than have low poly low quality substitutes. Don't forget this is a combat sandbox and not all people are high in the air all the time, not to mention Combined Arms users.

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