Andrei Dragovic Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 I have pulled the Mirage out of the hangar lately and am curious what the standard formations are for this jet as used by the AdA. More specifically, I have two questions: 1. What are the formations, their spacing and reference points. I.e. what are the AdA equivalents of: - Fingertip/Parade - Route/Cruise - Tacform - Line abreast/Spread, Fighting Wing/Fighter Wing, Echelon/Deployed Echelon etc. 2. What the procedures and reference points for Rendezvouses? (For US aircraft the reference points are always to superimpose the outer wingtip on the vertical stabiliser, but I don't think that works for a delta wing...) Thanks in advance. "Lawyer by Profession, Pilot by Heart...and self-confessed Harrier tragic" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph21 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Equivalent of Fingertip/Parade is called PS for Patrouille Serrée Tac formations are - FMO (Formation de Manoeuvre Offensive) which is the equivalent of Tac Wing i would say, with a 0.2/0.3 Nm range between lead/wingman. Mostly used by M2000D for low altitude, not that much in Air-Air combat - FMD (Formation de Manoeuvre Defensive) is the equivalent of Line Abreast mainly used for Air-Air Combat Rendez vous are always done in the following sequence: Etagement - Retrait -Ecartement Etagement is done by putting lead slighty above horizon, then you close in on 45° angle on lead to reduce Retrait and finally you settle for Ecartement I don't know the reference points. Jojo might come around and give you a more detail answer :smartass: I would love to have more details also :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myHelljumper Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Equivalent of Fingertip/Parade is called PS for Patrouille Serrée Tac formations are - FMO (Formation de Manoeuvre Offensive) which is the equivalent of Tac Wing i would say, with a 0.2/0.3 Nm range between lead/wingman. Mostly used by M2000D for low altitude, not that much in Air-Air combat - FMD (Formation de Manoeuvre Defensive) is the equivalent of Line Abreast mainly used for Air-Air Combat Rendez vous are always done in the following sequence: Etagement - Retrait -Ecartement Etagement is done by putting lead slighty above horizon, then you close in on 45° angle on lead to reduce Retrait and finally you settle for Ecartement I don't know the reference points. Jojo might come around and give you a more detail answer :smartass: I would love to have more details also :thumbup: If you don't mind, could you tell me where this info comes from ? It's very interesting :). Helljumper - M2000C Guru Helljumper's Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCK3rTjezLUxPbWHvJJ3W2fA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph21 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) If you don't mind, could you tell me where this info comes from ? It's very interesting :). A part is taken from the book L'ARMEE DE L'AIR EN ACTION from Henri-Pierre Grolleau Another part is from having done a Stage Patrouille Serrée here: https://www.air-combat-experience.fr/ I was flying with a former Jaguar pilot (+4000h, and 4 years in the Patrouille de France) and he teached me how to handle rejoin, hold formation, crossing under and even fly some FMO during simulated Pop Up attacks. A former 2000N pilot was in the lead plane and was giving us hand signals and wing check signals We have done also some BFM :pilotfly: A lot of fun i can assure you :D Edited October 18, 2019 by Steph21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myHelljumper Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 No, jealousy is not burning my insides at the moment. Thanks for the info :). Helljumper - M2000C Guru Helljumper's Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCK3rTjezLUxPbWHvJJ3W2fA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azrayen Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Here you go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azrayen Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Also... pardon my French :D Close formation (Patrouille Serrée / PS) 1/ Vertical spacing (étagement): The #2 must see both the extrados (upper surface) and the intrados (under surface) of the leader's wing 2/ Fore and aft spacing (retrait): The #2 sees the leader's engine nozzle as an elongated oval 3/ Lateral spacing (écartement): The #2 aligns the leader's wingtip (nav light/EW antenna) with the scoop just above the root of the wing. ++ Az' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph21 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Thx a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrei Dragovic Posted October 19, 2019 Author Share Posted October 19, 2019 Thank you, Azrayen and Steph21, for your very informative replies. Certainly enough for me to go on here. :) "Lawyer by Profession, Pilot by Heart...and self-confessed Harrier tragic" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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