Virpil Throttle Wearing Out Already *please read*

I just fixed an issue that I am confident others will run into eventually with the Virpil throttle. This issue arose about a week ago. I noticed that on the left throttle (because I fly mostly with the throttles separated) that the once smooth travel was now a scratchy metal on metal feeling. It was providing friction that I didnt want and I knew something was up. I disassembled the entire throttle to discover what the issue was.

The adjustable detents are made from two ball bearings running over a slit in a piece of steel. when the ball sits in the slit this is the resistance you feel. The positions of those bearings are adjustable by the set screws on the bottom of the throttle. A good idea actually.

As seen in the picture the bearings have actually cut grooves into the approach for the slit. This is unusual as ball bearings are meant to roll, not slide. The balls are back spring mounted so they always are forced against the steel. The grooves on one side (left throttle) got so bad that it was scraping not rolling. I suspect that the ball bearing quality or functionality is suspect. Its not rolling and the other 3 look like eventually they will end up scratchy and bad.

The issue I take is that the ball and the plate of steel (picture) was shipped absolutely devoid of oil or grease. Zero lubrication. This was a mistake. It was a mistake to think it didnt need lubrication or it was a mistake to have forgotten it. Either way I ended up doing some extra work.

The solution for you guys is to check it which can only be done with a tear down. It wasn't difficult to disassemble or assemble the Virpil throttle. Take pictures along the way of the parts.

Because mine was so worn in, lube didnt help. I flipped the plate over for a fresh start and lubed that side. I suspect this will eventually break down again because of a non rolling bearing. I hope I'm wrong.

Man, I hate to see that. Can you describe a little the order in which you disassemble the throttle axis block? I see some grease in there, but I'd love to replace it with Nyogel.

Oh I took the grips off, then the top plate and that exposes the steel plate on top, the one I took the picture of. What you are showing is the bottom and that's not the area in question. You need to remove the plastic buttoned grips and then the components will lift off exposing the area.

The plate is held on with 2 screws and lock washers. Its symmetrical so it doesn't matter which way you out it on. Its not hard to take grips off because they just have one wire that needs to be unplugged and therefore there is one slot only on re assembly. No confusion. Good design

edit. That part in your picture I never disassembled.

the ball bearings were they damaged looking (worn etc) ?

Hi backstab! I'm sorry to hear that you've had some issues with your throttle - can you get in touch with our support team please so we can investigate this further for you?

Could that it be that when the ball approaches the slit, there is more pressure on the ball and it prevents it from rolling? Now, after reading what you wrote, I can potentially explain why I feel a slight increase in resistance near the detent - it may be the ball gradually getting closer to the slit (the distance between center of the bearing and the ball to the plate would shorten) and compressing the spring. I hope I am guessing wrong, as this would be slightly prone to failures like yours.

Just guessing here, I am bit hesitant to disassemble mine as nothing is wrong with it. I hope the support sorts this out for you, please let us know the outcome.

btw: I'd definitely not put any Nyogel (damping) in there.

Could that it be that when the ball approaches the slit, there is more pressure on the ball and it prevents it from rolling? Now, after reading what you wrote, I can potentially explain why I feel a slight increase in resistance near the detent - it may be the ball gradually getting closer to the slit (the distance between center of the bearing an the ball would shorten) and compressing the spring. I hope I am guessing wrong, as this would be slightly prone to failures like yours.

 

Just guessing here, I am bit hesitant to disassemble mine as nothing is wrong with it. I hope the support sorts this out for you, please let us know the outcome.

 

btw: I'd definitely not put any Nyogel (damping) in there.

+1. Recently noticed the same thing, a little more resistance near the detents.

I'm in the same boat as you, don't want to open it up as nothing is wrong with it (yet?).

Hi,

Looks like mine is starting to groove as well.

.. and I really haven't used my throttle that much .. +- 3 hours .. :(

Virpil need to make some suggestions, on how to alleviate further 'grooving' of that plate. :book:

.. perhaps they need to make that 'plate' out of some other material .. e.g. teflon or nylon.

What I've done in the interim, .. is give the 'plate' a couple of coats of dry PTFE lubricant. (to reduce friction)

.. and, when I put the plate back, I just 'nipped' the 2 screws that hold it in, not totally (over)tightened them. (to reduce pressure on the ball bearings).

Throttle feels smooth(er), .. and Indent seems fine .. :)

Cheers

Tom

+1 more resistance near the detent

After seeing your pictures with the worn metal plates, I am glad that I have not ordered the throttle yet. Therefore, I will certainly wait until the layout has been improved by the manufacturer. :noexpression:

A quick fix would be to just flip the plate upside down, although that would only be a temporary solution. The leading edge of the groove could be very slightly radiused to help alleviate the problems of the ball bearing meeting a hard edge and sudden obstruction, although ideally the detent would be a milled trough (and the ball bearing in constant rolling contact) rather than a void.

The plate also looks too close to the detent ring. My reasoning for this is that the length of the worn groove is long, indicating that the ball bearing stays in contact for a long time indicating a long length of travel against its spring. The ball bearing only really needs to come into contact with the plate near the detent.

Lastly, and crucially, the plate should be hardened.

All this aside though, a much better design would have been to have the ball bearings or roller pins where the plate is (or elsewhere around the axis) and instead have the detent grooves on the adjustable bushings instead (either hardened steel or bronze).

Unless the plate is made of cheese or the ball made of cutting diamond, I doubt these grooves would appear there after 3 hours of usage. They might be pre-cut (perhaps to alleviate pressure change), guessing by pictures in not very precise manner.

I'll stop speculating, but it does bother me. @Cyph3r, some light on this would be much appreciated.

After seeing your pictures with the worn metal plates, I am glad that I have not ordered the throttle yet. Therefore, I will certainly wait until the layout has been improved by the manufacturer. :noexpression:

+1

Im sure this is going to turn into a gigantic problem for Virpil. I hope they have an engineer looking into a solution. Its not rocket science but some other materials or some different mechanism is needed. It looks like a good idea but whomever authorized this didnt think it through. How many times will we roll that ball past those detents. Click click click 20,000 times in its life and someone didnt understand the wear and tear factor.

Im still waiting on my ticket.

Backstab, would you mind explaining how did you get to this plate? I can check mine, but your previous explanation is too vague.

Im sure this is going to turn into a gigantic problem for Virpil. I hope they have an engineer looking into a solution. Its not rocket science but some other materials or some different mechanism is needed. It looks like a good idea but whomever authorized this didnt think it through. How many times will we roll that ball past those detents. Click click click 20,000 times in its life and someone didnt understand the wear and tear factor.

 

Im still waiting on my ticket.

Hope so too, and that Cyph3r will respond as soon as they've investigated the problem.

The plate is located between the throttles. It is just under the top plate with all the switches on it. To access it you need to remove the plastic grips that are screwed on top of each of the power arms. Once those are off then undo the screws on the top plate and the plastic incremented dust cover that sits on top of the top plate. This dust cover will come up and off. Then remove the two plastic arced dust covers. All this stuff needs to come up and off so you can lift the large metal top plate off. As soon as you do this you will see it.

You have the option to remove both halves of the metal top plate with all the switches on it but if I recall you just need to remove the plate over the throttle levers. I cant think if you need to remove any screws from the bottom of the throttle..

Just do it. Take photos and mark the wires with a marker. Its not calculating your shadow on the moon. Its basically a must do IMO so get on it. Total time is about 30 minutes to take apart and re assemble. I wish I took better pics.

If anyone else does this, please take pics of each step!

I agree, that it seems impossible those grooves were cut in 3 hours? Surely, that would have been quickly noticed in beta testing?

Im sure this is going to turn into a gigantic problem for Virpil. I hope they have an engineer looking into a solution. Its not rocket science but some other materials or some different mechanism is needed. It looks like a good idea but whomever authorized this didnt think it through. How many times will we roll that ball past those detents. Click click click 20,000 times in its life and someone didnt understand the wear and tear factor.

 

Im still waiting on my ticket.

Usually this kinda stuff is caught with good QA and a lot of wear testing. Let's hope it's an isolated situation.

... I agree, that it seems impossible those grooves were cut in 3 hours? Surely, that would have been quickly noticed in beta testing?

Why shouldn't those grooves be cut in 3 hours? Just land on a carrier a few times and have a look at how often you'll be moving the throttles during that time. The bearing is made of hardened material and the plate probably not. Those grooves will be inside the plate pretty soon if pressure is high enough. And you're right - they should have noticed that during beta testing... :huh:

Why shouldn't those grooves be cut in 3 hours? Just land on a carrier a few times and have a look at how often you'll be moving the throttles during that time. The bearing is made of hardened material and the plate probably not. Those grooves will be inside the plate pretty soon if pressure is high enough. And you're right - they should have noticed that during beta testing... :huh:

Or even AAR. Nothing but a flurry of activity with the throttle.

Hope this gets worked out for you folks quickly.

I have 96 hours on this throttle with 69 AARs and god knows how many carrier landings, formation flying etc, (according to DCS log) since I bought it (wiped the log the day I plugged it). No signs of any friction, except slightly higher resistance around detents, was there since new.

Can't be bothered to open it, I poked around this morning and it's definitely not user serviceable unlike stick base. If it ever breaks, I am just going to send it back.

I have 96 hours on this throttle with 69 AARs and god knows how many carrier landings, formation flying etc, (according to DCS log) since I bought it (wiped the log the day I plugged it). No signs of any friction, except slightly higher resistance around detents, was there since new.

Can't be bothered to open it, I poked around this morning and it's definitely not user serviceable unlike stick base. If it ever breaks, I am just going to send it back.

Is not the throttle axis too short compared to the warthog axis?

Is not the throttle axis too short compared to the warthog axis?

No

I have 96 hours on this throttle with 69 AARs and god knows how many carrier landings, formation flying etc, (according to DCS log) since I bought it (wiped the log the day I plugged it). No signs of any friction, except slightly higher resistance around detents, was there since new.

Can't be bothered to open it, I poked around this morning and it's definitely not user serviceable unlike stick base. If it ever breaks, I am just going to send it back.

^^ What he said!