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Can no longer trim down after brakes, slow speed


Pikey

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I read the other post on trim, but I tried everything. When I touch and go, the plane wants to lurch up as if trimmed all the way back, but I can't get the trim to move and have to fly stick planted forwards. The trim indicator shows it is down. I have checked the released air brakes (I use WH brake button 7,8 as per A-10C) the button is in neutral.

 

 

Any ideas?

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If you enter the mission and you see that your trim indicator moves fully into one direction (up or down) without you doing anything, that means you have some button in your HOTAS set to speedbrake UP or speedbrake DOWN and that button is placed in one of those positions. You must review your inputs configuration.

Roberto "Vibora" Seoane

Alas Rojas

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

If you keep the speedbrake button in the retract position, it trims down. If you keep the speedbrake button in the extend position, it trims up. If speedbrake is neutral, trim is not changed.

 

So extending speedbrake and keeping the button depressed after the brake is extended (on the Warthog HOTAS this button is not spring centered), it keeps trimming up, and the trim button on the joystick is not able to counter it unless you neutralize the speedbrake button.

 

A bug?

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If you keep the speedbrake button in the retract position, it trims down. If you keep the speedbrake button in the extend position, it trims up. If speedbrake is neutral, trim is not changed.

 

So extending speedbrake and keeping the button depressed after the brake is extended (on the Warthog HOTAS this button is not spring centered), it keeps trimming up, and the trim button on the joystick is not able to counter it unless you neutralize the speedbrake button.

 

A bug?

It's not a bug. It's a feature.

Try to use spring loaded buttons for that, or do not forget to set it to neutral again after retraction (extension).

On the Warthog, the speed brake button is only spring-loaded for extension, so be careful with that, or use spring-loaded buttons like hats, for instance.

Roberto "Vibora" Seoane

Alas Rojas

 

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sigpic97175_2_small.pngAERGES-LOGO-sin_fondo_small.png

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It's not a bug. It's a feature.

Try to use spring loaded buttons for that, or do not forget to set it to neutral again after retraction (extension).

On the Warthog, the speed brake button is only spring-loaded for extension, so be careful with that, or use spring-loaded buttons like hats, for instance.

 

 

Thanks. So, is the real aircraft made so that if you hold the speedbrake deploy button (even if the speedbrake has reached full deployment), the aircraft trims up and up until you release the speedbrake button?


Edited by McRuffen
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It's not a bug. It's a feature.

Try to use spring loaded buttons for that, or do not forget to set it to neutral again after retraction (extension).

On the Warthog, the speed brake button is only spring-loaded for extension, so be careful with that, or use spring-loaded buttons like hats, for instance.

I see that the old brake toggle assignment is still available so that is another option if you just want to press a button to toggle the brake on and off. I like the more realistic way, though. :)
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It's not a bug. It's a feature.

Try to use spring loaded buttons for that, or do not forget to set it to neutral again after retraction (extension).

On the Warthog, the speed brake button is only spring-loaded for extension, so be careful with that, or use spring-loaded buttons like hats, for instance.

 

Even tough my Hotas does have a spring loaded button for extending the airbrake, my profile actually uses the airbrake_toggle command, like this:

 

BTN T10 /P Airbrake_Toggle

/R Airbrake_Toggle

 

It generates a single keycommand on Pressing the button, and another single key when Released. It was working fine until a couple days ago.

 

Now, after upgrading to the latest Openbeta, whenever I extend the airbrake, the aircraft pitch trim goes crazy and even if I close the airbrake the trim still doesnt work properly.

 

Will test it a bit more tomorrow and generate a track, but to me there was a real change after the latest update ... right now I've had to refrain from using the airbrake anymore :(

 

Anyone else has noticed this?

 

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Will test it a bit more tomorrow and generate a track, but to me there was a real change after the latest update ... right now I've had to refrain from using the airbrake anymore :(

 

OK, here I've a video that shows the changes on pitch trim level when extending/retracting the airbrake. The airbrake is extended and retracted by pressing the key "b" once.

 

LxRalz_zeas

 

On the first minute of the video I trim the aircraft for level flight, so far it works correctly.

 

Once over the Airbases's Outer Marker, I extend the Speed Brake and then the trim gradually goes all the way forward (nose down) on its own, I open the control windows so you can see that I'm having to fight this nosedown with my stick.

 

Then I close the Speed Brake and then the trim gradually goes all the way back, not stopping at the previous trim level that I had. Now I have to fight with the stick to try to get the nose level.

 

This behavior started on OpenBeta version 2.5.4.26368

 

I'm also attaching the track file of this flight.

For now, the only workaround I've found is to not use airbrake at all :(

 

Hope Aviodev can reproduce the problem, so they can correct this.

 

 

Eduardo

C101CC - Test Speed Brake.trk

 

For work: iMac mid-2010 of 27" - Core i7 870 - 6 GB DDR3 1333 MHz - ATI HD5670 - SSD 256 GB - HDD 2 TB - macOS High Sierra

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I can confirm also.

Works perfectly with normal joystick inputs (trim stops after button press) but doesn't stop with single keyboard press.

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The airbrake is extended and retracted by pressing the key "b" once.

Although I don't own the module - AFAIK you *must* use:

 

LShift + 'B' for "Air brake - Extend"

LCtrl + 'B' for "Air brake - Retract"

 

These are momentary positions and the air brake switch returns to it's centre/neutral position, when the key combination is released.

 

The 'B' toggle switches between Air brake switch held forward and held back and will drive the pitch trim (a feature of the real aircraft), thus using 'B' to toggle the air brake between fully open and fully closed is only suitable for 'Game' flight mode.

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It most likely got broken when implementing speed brake for rear cockpit in multiplayer.

I could only test keyboard command B since I'm right now with my laptop and without any joystick, but I guess this would also reproduce when using a joystick button.

Until one of our programmers (or myself) takes a look at it, which could take some time, I recommend you use Air brake - Extend and Air brake - Retract in input options, moreover, this is the realistic way to do it. In fact Air brake - Toggle should be deleted from the module since it's not how it works IRL. In your case, I recommend you use T9 to extend (LShift + B) and T10 to retract (LCtrl + B), since T9 is a spring loaded type of switch if I recall correctly, it would work perfectly and you should be careful when using T10, since you need to remember to bring it back to neutral when the speed brake is fully retracted (or deployed if you decide to do it the other way around).

Roberto "Vibora" Seoane

Alas Rojas

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

sigpic97175_2_small.pngAERGES-LOGO-sin_fondo_small.png

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Although I don't own the module - AFAIK you *must* use:

 

LShift + 'B' for "Air brake - Extend"

LCtrl + 'B' for "Air brake - Retract"

 

I have this module since 2015 .. didn't use these key-commands at first because LSHF-B only opens the airbrake a little bit.

 

You have to keep it pressed to get the airbrake to fully deploy ... the problem with this, is that while you have the key pressed, no other keys are accepted by the aircraft. For example, lets say I go to external view (press F2) ... then I press LSHF+B, the airbrake opens a little bit ... if I keep it pressed, then it keeps opening ... if, while it's opening, I try to return to the cockpit with F1, the sim doesnt get the F1 key .. I've to release the LSHF+B in order to give any further key commands.

 

Same for retract .. LCTL + B closes just a bit, you have to keep it pressed until fully closed.

 

That's why I've been all these year just using the B command, that with a single keypress fully opens or fully closes.


Edited by Rudel_chw

 

For work: iMac mid-2010 of 27" - Core i7 870 - 6 GB DDR3 1333 MHz - ATI HD5670 - SSD 256 GB - HDD 2 TB - macOS High Sierra

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It most likely got broken when implementing speed brake for rear cockpit in multiplayer.

 

Hi Vibora,

 

I can only say that it was working fine until the previous version of Openbeta :(

 

Until one of our programmers (or myself) takes a look at it, which could take some time, I recommend you use Air brake - Extend and Air brake - Retract in input options, moreover, this is the realistic way to do it. In fact Air brake - Toggle should be deleted from the module since it's not how it works IRL. In your case, I recommend you use T9 to extend (LShift + B) and T10 to retract (LCtrl + B), since T9 is a spring loaded type of switch if I recall correctly, it would work perfectly and you should be careful when using T10, since you need to remember to bring it back to neutral when the speed brake is fully retracted (or deployed if you decide to do it the other way around).

 

I've just tried to do as you suggest, and memories of why I was using the airbrake-toggle key command came back to me :) ... the extend and retract keys only open/close the airbrake just a bit .. you need to keep the keys pressed to get the airbrake to fully deploy/retract.

 

I've no problem with getting my Hotas to keep the key pressed .. but the problem is that DCS wont't detect further key commands until I release the airbrake keys.

 

I dont know if the real aircraft requires the pilot to keep pressing the throttle command in order to get full extension/retraction .. I know that on the A-10 I can do this, but it has a cockpit gauge to check how much open/closed is currently.

 

For work: iMac mid-2010 of 27" - Core i7 870 - 6 GB DDR3 1333 MHz - ATI HD5670 - SSD 256 GB - HDD 2 TB - macOS High Sierra

For Gaming: 34" Monitor - Ryzen 3600X - 32 GB DDR4 2400 - nVidia GTX1070ti - SSD 1.25 TB - HDD 10 TB - Win10 Pro - TM HOTAS Cougar - Oculus Rift CV1

Mobile: iPad Pro 12.9" of 256 GB

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... the problem with this, is that while you have the key pressed, no other keys are accepted by the aircraft. For example, lets say I go to external view (press F2) ... then I press LSHF+B, the airbrake opens a little bit ... if I keep it pressed, then it keeps opening ... if, while it's opening, I try to return to the cockpit with F1, the sim doesnt get the F1 key .. I've to release the LSHF+B in order to give any further key commands.
I don't have this issue. I tried opening the brake in external view and then pressing F1 while holding the brake. It returns to cockpit view and the brake continues to close until I release it. Same with retract.
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I don't have this issue. I tried opening the brake in external view and then pressing F1 while holding the brake. It returns to cockpit view and the brake continues to close until I release it. Same with retract.

 

 

OK, then it must be a limitation of my HOTAS :( ... don't worry, I will look for a workaround, perhaps a Macro that presses the key 17 times :)

 

For work: iMac mid-2010 of 27" - Core i7 870 - 6 GB DDR3 1333 MHz - ATI HD5670 - SSD 256 GB - HDD 2 TB - macOS High Sierra

For Gaming: 34" Monitor - Ryzen 3600X - 32 GB DDR4 2400 - nVidia GTX1070ti - SSD 1.25 TB - HDD 10 TB - Win10 Pro - TM HOTAS Cougar - Oculus Rift CV1

Mobile: iPad Pro 12.9" of 256 GB

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