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How is the AI?


motoadve

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Depending on the skill, it's either bad or horrible. Either easy to kill or just horrible to fly against due to their infinite love to loops.

 

Yes they use the SFM, so their engine doesn't overheat like yours at low speed. And together with their invisible speed brakes it can make your life harder than it should be.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Is it aafe to say that the AI set to excellent is capable of inhuman levels of piloting? It seems that the Spit IX and the K-4 are neigh unstoppable when set to expert.

Fire only at close range, and only when your opponent is properly in your sights.

 

-Hauptmann Oswald Boelcke, Jasta 2

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They use a simple FM so yes they can be kind of UFO like but they are beatable.

9./JG27

 

"If you can't hit anything, it's because you suck. If you get shot down, it's because you suck. You and me, we know we suck, and that makes it ok." - Worst person in all of DCS

 

"In the end, which will never come, we will all be satisifed... we must fight them on forum, we will fight them on reddit..." - Dunravin

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Beatable but if in an energy fighter like the FW190, and on, or at, equal energy and altitude, you'll have a hell of a time escaping from one of the allied planes.

 

Keep that in mind when designing missions and give German planes an altitude advantage. I've started up with the mission editor again because of this, and will fly my missions with an objective in mind in future.

 

With DCS WW2, if you want any content, you will need to design it yourself and to keep things interesting, learn how to randomize what will happen in each mission. I think the historical accuracy thing prevents the community from creating any content for it.

 

The AI is at least for me, more challenging than in the other sim, and gives me a greater sense of satisfaction when I shoot something down.

 

Took me much longer to get some success in DCS than that sim, especially with the energy fighters (although to tell the truth the 109's murdered me in the P51 and I haven't flown that module very much).

 

In the other sim, against the AI (at least the last time I played) the enemy always seemed to fly downwards in circles.

 

I think I prefer a UFO, OP AI, that is more challenging, than one that is too easy. Although at least early war, if I am Germany against a hopeless soviet AI it's actually quite realistic when you think about it!

 

If a bit of a noob like me, and still practicing, diving B and Z marksmanship and deflection shots, you will still have plenty to do and learn.

 

I think its the hardened flight sim veterans who have more frustration with both sims to be honest in SP, as no doubt for them it will all be too easy. I personally dont have a problem with it, at least for now! Just need someone who isn't me to design a campaign or two!


Edited by Wolf8312

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Well being mostly a groundpounder, plus flying Allied & quirky for the most part (i.e. L-39 ground attack & stuff), I recently decided to check both the Biffer and the Dora out and did set up a couple A-to-A missions against AI Stangs mostly. Found out that if you put them on average and give them 100% fuel (i.e. a full fuselage tank), they're well beatable and I actually shot numerous down because they're not so UFO anymore. All OK? No. Their FMs are believable? No. They're not UFOs anymore? No, they still are. But as far as test environments go, that _did_ suffice. Just so you know...

The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of.

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The AI is just very predictable and biased towards one fighting/flying style. It likes turning a lot (and does it quite well at higher skill levels) and if you get behind them in these turns they start trying high yo yos. Works well if it’s a 109 vs a Pony which has a lower power to weight ratio but is the wrong move if you are in the weaker climbing aircraft. Hence why the Spit and 109 do the best while the Dora is the worst when it comes to Ai fighting each other.

9./JG27

 

"If you can't hit anything, it's because you suck. If you get shot down, it's because you suck. You and me, we know we suck, and that makes it ok." - Worst person in all of DCS

 

"In the end, which will never come, we will all be satisifed... we must fight them on forum, we will fight them on reddit..." - Dunravin

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Not only the SFM, when Spit was released the FM was quiet good, but there is now no Point where you make Energy against a Spitfire right now in the Dora, so dogfighting or B&Z is only possible so long you keep the Spit busy they have to evade attacks...

It even out accelerate Dora and k4 in Dive now..!?!?!

Low Wingload low weight and draggy Watercooler stands for good Dive acceleration?

 

 

Take K4 without MW-50 and dive away from a Spitfire happy to see your Results...

 

 

http://www.spitfireperformance.com/109gtac.html

Once you have tasted Flight, you will forever walk the Earth with your Eyes turned Skyward.

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

9./JG27

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The Spit seems like a very formidable aircraft to fly against under any circumstance. I have been trying to beat a Spit in a Dora 1v1 with the Spit set to excellent, and it has been very very difficult.

 

Against a Mustang I can eventually gain the upper hand, but it's a long journey to get behind the pony. I'll be honest though, the vertical convergence in the Dora still throws me for a loop. Much higher than I'm used to.

 

Does anyone know what the default convergences are for the WWII birds?

Fire only at close range, and only when your opponent is properly in your sights.

 

-Hauptmann Oswald Boelcke, Jasta 2

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The Spit seems like a very formidable aircraft to fly against under any circumstance. I have been trying to beat a Spit in a Dora 1v1 with the Spit set to excellent, and it has been very very difficult.

 

Against a Mustang I can eventually gain the upper hand, but it's a long journey to get behind the pony. I'll be honest though, the vertical convergence in the Dora still throws me for a loop. Much higher than I'm used to.

 

Does anyone know what the default convergences are for the WWII birds?

600m if nothing changed, as per Historical charts. It's good to properly set your revi sight to fit those values as well as proper wingspan and everything gets way easier.

 

 

S!

"I went into the British Army believing that if you want peace you must prepare for war. I believe now that if you prepare for war, you get war."

-- Major-General Frederick B. Maurice

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Well I don't know. There're changeable FM files in each AC home directory. Has anyone tried to change them for the AI? No MP compatibility, I know, but sod that for now.

The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of.

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Does anyone know what the default convergences are for the WWII birds?

I try to follow these, 109 is from G6/U4 handbuch, but weapon layout is the same.

It seems to me that ED is close them at least 190.

190D.JPG.0076e2e232d75afa805dafe253e5c25b.JPG

109G_U4.thumb.JPG.175a0881fe173d59f99fb367b314a0f8.JPG

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Awesome charts!! Thr Mustang Convergence isn't nearly as bad as I thought according to this. If they followed that chart, then the horizontal convergence is at 333-400 yards with the pattern, and that's not the 800+ YARDS I think I've heard thrown around. Strange feeling not having the guns all set to a single point, but I think I can see the advantage.

 

For the US and their .50's they must've figured just getting rounds on the the target would be enough for a kill. I'm still curious as to what exactly the thought process was though.

 

Simplified Flight Model for the AI is somewhat of a shame since it feels as though they can ride the edge of the stall a lot more effectively than you can. Also, the higher AI always make the most perfect guns solution even at 600+ yards where a player would likely not even fire. I do like the AI though because, even though they are doing some questionable things at times they are far more believable than AI in other games. The flight model is definitely much more believabl, and definitely more immersive. It'd just be great to see how good the new damage model is going to be as well.

Fire only at close range, and only when your opponent is properly in your sights.

 

-Hauptmann Oswald Boelcke, Jasta 2

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I said 600m, forgot to mention, for German aircraft I thought you were asking for don't know why :lol:.

 

S!

"I went into the British Army believing that if you want peace you must prepare for war. I believe now that if you prepare for war, you get war."

-- Major-General Frederick B. Maurice

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I didn't mean I've heard that in this thread, and frankly it was probably just a misunderstanding on my part anyhow. I was asking about all the WWII birds so good to see the German and US charts there.

Fire only at close range, and only when your opponent is properly in your sights.

 

-Hauptmann Oswald Boelcke, Jasta 2

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The AI's better now because they get damaged more easily and bail out sooner, instead of trying to fight you in a broken machine. But what's with the endless loops and yo-yos? The AI sure like their vertical, but also seem to run out of energy a bit sooner now. Is the UFO era finally coming to an end? Here's hoping :thumbup:

The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of.

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for my taste the AI bails out way too soon now...one little hit and the AI surrenders and jumps. for me thats no improvement.

what would be an improvement is that your hits had an actual effect on the flying characteristics on the AI.

what would be an improvement is that the AI didnt have marksmen capabilities that no human has.

what would be an improvement is that the AI in a big offline furball, with lets say 10vs10, not only followed you and finally stopped ignoring the other AI oponents....

 

there is much room for improvement....the change that the AI decides to bail out after the first little scratch is imo just a workaround for an actual problem, without solving it.

imo makes it worse, as it keeps ending dogfights way too quickly, and i have the impression that this new AI routine usually prevents you from making your killshot.

in comparison, online dogfights usually start where now the offline dogfights end.


Edited by birdstrike
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Not only the SFM, when Spit was released the FM was quiet good, but there is now no Point where you make Energy against a Spitfire right now in the Dora, so dogfighting or B&Z is only possible so long you keep the Spit busy they have to evade attacks...

It even out accelerate Dora and k4 in Dive now..!?!?!

Low Wingload low weight and draggy Watercooler stands for good Dive acceleration?

 

 

Take K4 without MW-50 and dive away from a Spitfire happy to see your Results...

 

 

http://www.spitfireperformance.com/109gtac.html

 

 

When you're talking about the Spitfire non-AI FM you're definitely right. The Spit is capable to climb vertically with the 109, no overheating, 3 hits from 1km bellow in the 109's wing are enough to seize the engine, it easily follows the Dora in the shallow left turn climb.. and so on..

The AI is.. well, I don't play against it as it's a mood killer, at least to say..

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Room for improvement, yes, absolutely. Still better now than it used to be. Glass half full or empty?

 

well...i dont consider it as an improvement.its not a glass full or empty thing...you can perfectly like that change, and thats good for u then :)

 

i explained why i dont like this change.

 

one question though...do you jump out that quickly when the AI hits u slightly? :)


Edited by birdstrike
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do you jump out that quickly when the AI hits u slightly?

 

No. And neither do the AI Spits BTW, according to you in that other thread. Where does that leave us, or anywhere?

 

Look, the AI's still in need of improvement and no-one's contradicting that. I just said the current behaviour is IMO better. And that's it, I'm done tangoing with you here -> OUT

The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of.

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No. And neither do the AI Spits BTW, according to you in that other thread. Where does that leave us, or anywhere?

 

Look, the AI's still in need of improvement and no-one's contradicting that. I just said the current behaviour is IMO better. And that's it, I'm done tangoing with you here -> OUT

 

where did i say what? :music_whistling:

 

 

yeah...in your view its better...in my view not, and i explained why. am i allowed? ;)


Edited by birdstrike
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Said I'm done with you, but I'll just refresh your failing memory all the same before I go:

 

in dcs we can observe spits not trying to go home, but keep dogfighting with 1complete wing shot off, doing all sorts of manouvers on a daily basis. and sometimes even see spits dogfighting with 0 wings.

The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of.

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