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Posts posted by mvsgas

  1. 19 hours ago, Bouli306 said:



    Yes, nitrogen is actually introduced in the hydraulic lines via the actuators. That is why you can expect a hydraulic B failure soon after alternate gear extension.  That is why the NWS is not functional after alternate LDG extension.

    Go learn about Landing Gear Hydraulic isolation valve, how it works and its relation to the alt gear extension. That will answer why NWS does not work and why no air is introduce to the hydraulics if all alt gear procedures are followed and the system is working as it should. The most common way air is introduced to system B is when people press that reset button at the same time the pull the handle.

  2. 10 hours ago, sdirmitt said:

    yeah, big no, that is not the only way...alt gear handle allows stored nitrogen in the alt gear reservoir to introduce nitrogen into the hydraulic lines to "blow down" the gear. I've done many many alt landing gear checks


    You write that you have done many alt landing gear checks, but then you also write that the handle introduces nitrogen into the hydraulic lines? If you have done that, you done something very wrong. Pulling the alt gear handle sends pressurize nitrogen to all 3 door actuators and the the NLG retract/extend actuator through its own pneumatic line. That is why there are 3 line on the actuators.



    9 hours ago, Frederf said:

    I always thought the big white button in the middle of the handle was a release button in order to return the alt gear handle back in. Turns out it's not. It's for bleeding air out of the system. Alt gear operation surely has to be modeled at some point.

    Your not alone, many pilots and some maintainers (weapons loading crews and specialist that work with the avionics) think that also. Pressing the white button resets the landing gear sequence valve in the left MLG wheel well. So if you press the button and pull the handle you are resenting the valve while trying to move it with nitrogen pressure, pushing nitrogen in all the hydraulic lines. I seen that happen several times before and now someone has to bleed the nitrogen out of the B hydraulic system.

  3. On 9/21/2021 at 12:01 AM, Badlego said:

    Please correct me but i thought so far that throttle Inputs are handed from the Cockpit to a Computer and then to the engine and therefore setting the throttle to idle too early does Nothing as the computer will only start up the engines in the proper conditions. I have No sources for that but i Wonder why the digital Interface has Not been discussed Here yet. Maybe in Startup the Computer System is Not running yet or bypassed for safety reasons?

    There are two input to the engine, Main is throttle position switch that sends Power Lever Angle (PLA) to the Digital Engine Computer (DEC). The second input is physical push/pull wire the connects the throttle control linkage on the Main Engine Control (MEC). This is the only physical connection to any control in the F-16 (any versions). The DEC is like you car engine Electronic Control Module (ECM). The MEC is like very complicated carburetor (not even close in reality, but same concept )


    The DEC nor the MEC  will prevent you from introducing fuel to early to the combustion chamber AFAIK. Other aircraft the start is very automatic, for example A-10 seem way easier. But in the F-117, F-15 and F-16 you can't just put throttle to idle and hit start.

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  4. For what is worth, I do not know of anyone IRL ( pilot or maintainer) that has ever tried to move the throttle to idle from cutoff on purpose without RPM being at 20% or higher (PW-220E, 220 or GE-100). I know some that have made a mistake (rushing or not paying attention) that have started the JFS with throttle on idle, but corrected immediately and terminated the start because IRL, starting the engine is a critical thing. Everything happens very fast and you are paying attention to RPM, FTIT, oil pressure, main gen and stand by gen lights. Started the JFS with throttle in idle could raise FTIT rapidly, which is signs of a anticipated hot start. Manuals have a very specific terminology for anticipated hot start we all have to memorize to qualify as an engine run person. This also would be sign of autoaccel condition, also cause you to terminated engine start.


    So, whom ever said is not a thing IRL, has never been run qualified in USAF on any F-16. GE engines can not go from 0 to 100 and I can't think of anyone would try IRL. In the last couple years I work on F-16 with PW engine (Luke AFB in 2009 to 2011) you had to run the JFS for 2 minutes before going to idle, to allow the bleed strap time to close.


    So IRL, you pay close attention when starting the engine and this is not a problem. In DCS, people just what to flip switch while drinking coffee and start as quickly as possible to airquake and are not paying attention, the only reason this is a problem.


    Some will say: "Well, we do not have those engine in DCS" your right, I was never run qualified in GE-129. They can also say: "You have never started the JFS with throttle in idle, so you don't know what will happens". Again you are right on that also.

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  5. On 9/12/2021 at 8:50 AM, sdirmitt said:

    Well main power plus a -60...otherwise you will have  the reading from last power on via engine running or -60

    Of course I main power plus AGE (-60 or -86) connected and running with power cord connected and power switch on. How else do you get main power if the engine is not running and you don't have AGE? I did not think I needed to explain that.

    Let me rephrase:

    On 9/8/2021 at 9:25 PM, mvsgas said:

    There is not Oxygen pressure gauge nor a liquid oxygen level gauge in the DCS version. The pressure gauge on the seat O2 bottle can't be seen in game and is irrelevant and the oxygen supply gauge on the Oxygen regulator panel indicate pressure at the regulator, with the OBOGS should not have pressure until engine is working AFAIK. In DCS, it uses On Board Oxygen Generator System (OBOGS). The F-16 that carry liquid oxygen have a liquid level gauge, but you need to apply main power ( meaning engine is running and either main gen or stanby gen operating) or ground power is on (-60 or -86) for the fuel gauge and the liquid O2 level gauge to show proper numbers. One of the many reason we do power on checks (with AGE) every day before flight IRL.


    • Like 1
  6. On 9/9/2021 at 9:06 AM, Dee-Jay said:

    Manual unlock is mainly in case of solenoid failure of the lock system.

    Please tell me  more, how does every component in the landing gear system works. Would love to know.


    On 9/9/2021 at 9:13 AM, Dee-Jay said:

    The issue with the handle is the logic of the lollipop (red light) which should remains lite anytime one door is not locked in the up/down position. Not only tied to the NLG/MLG.


    In other words, should be off only when:

    NLG+MLG are up and locked + all doors closed en locked.


    NLG+MLG are down and locked + all doors in open position. (do not remember if they are locked open)

    With the LG handle up, the light on the handle remains on until all doors are close. There is a switch in each door actuator that is triggered when door are fully close. This will also cut off all hydraulic pressure to the LG and brakes while the gear is up and lock. With the handle down, the light remain on until you get three green lights. Three green light indicate the LG in down and lock. There are plungers switches in the drag braces down lock mechanism.


    On 9/10/2021 at 9:39 PM, mytai01 said:

    The down permission button doesn't appear to be a thing in game. It would probably be annoying it it were in the game as no one has a control stick with such a button. I guess it's just an automatic thing.

    How would it be different than the DCS Mig-21 landing gear lock?


    18 hours ago, mytai01 said:

    IRL, it is an important enough checklist item to get a special WARNING note to make sure the LG handle is positively in the down and locked position before applying any power to the jet.

    The only reason this matters IRL, is because during the aircraft launch, we remove the NLG safety pin. So if you start the engine with the LG handle up, the NLG will start retracting as soon as you have B system pressure. The wow switches only prevent the handle from moving, not the landing gear from retracting.




    But the question remains, why raise the handle on the ground in DCS? other than to say: "ED this is wrong"

  7. On 9/7/2021 at 6:58 AM, Bricux said:

    I don't want to pretend to be an expert, ...



    Why it will be easier to track bug reports when they are done individually.

    Emergency Jettison should work with EPU power AFAIK, the other stuff, I do not know.


    On another note:

    They lights work as they should in DCS, AFAIK

    Reference photo is from a Norwegian A motel and video from a Polish block 52+. Not the same aircraft we have...yes, lighting systems change also. Hell A models only had one generator and EPU for main electrical power. We should have Main gen, stand by gen and EPU in DCS...point, things change for versions to versions, country to country and year to year, etc.


    That is wrong, not Norwegian, Netherlands, but it is an A model. Wing structural patches show that

  8. Why it does that in DCS, I do not know. IRL, it should always lock in the up possition to prevent inadvertent extension during high G maneuvers. Did they implemented the down permission button? (white button on handle)


    But why raise the gear on the ground?

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  9. IRL, is the only way to deploy the landing gear without hydraulic system B pressure. EPU only power A system. So IRL, it will always be that way until the completely change the way hydraulics work in the F-16.


    Whether it will ever be implemented in DCS or not, I do not know

  10. There is not Oxygen pressure gauge on the DCS version. It uses On Board Oxygen Generator System (OBOGS). The F-16 that carry liquid oxygen have a gauge, but you need to apply  main power for the fuel gauge and the O2 gauge to show proper numbers. One of the many reason we do power on checks every day before flight IRL.


    On 2/9/2020 at 7:29 AM, mvsgas said:

    It should be fine once INS is completed in DCS. Alignment status 10 is the actual max reach during normal alignment in RL, to get align status 6 you would need to complete and Enhance Interrupted Alignment and this would take 12 to 16 minutes.


    Alignment status 10 should be good enough for even GPS guided weapons once INS is finish and JDAM is introduced in DCS.




  12. On 2/16/2019 at 12:04 AM, mvsgas said:

    The problem with this is no matter what ED decides to do, will be a case of damn if you do and damn if you don't. If they add it, someone is bound to "disagree" with it being available. That persons will have people that share the same opinion and they will all do thread after thread on how it should be removed.


    Sadly this will not end here. There is so much misinformation and confusion of what specifically an F-16 can do, there are going to be many thread like this for a while. Before and after it is release.


    On 8/19/2018 at 10:54 PM, mvsgas said:

    I have been here since 2005, even on the old website, I have seen it so many times. No matter what module they release, someone will want a different version with different capabilities. Go through the forums and see. From the P-51 to the Yak-52, from the Black Shark to the Gazelle, it has been repeated over and over.

    They add the chute, some one else will want the PW-200 engine of a early A model. They add that and someone will want the radar/EO display. Another will want the WAR HUD, then someone will want the WAC HUD, one of the may different radars, on and on.


    Aircraft like the F-16, Mig-21, F-4, etc. They have to stick to a specific version if not it will never end.


    I am hopeful that they will stick to a specific version, a specific year, a specific country and a specific level of modeling. If not, we will have to many variable and no matter what people will still complain. If they modeled every version of the F-16, with every possible configuration, someone will make a thread of how confusing it is and how they wish it was a simplified version like a FC3 or MAC aircraft.


    So whether they model a 1995 USAF block 50 with 30% accuracy or a 2010 USAF block 50 with 96% accuracy, I will be happy as long as they stick to it and don't start changing it.



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  13. On 8/6/2021 at 2:21 PM, Frederf said:

    I've heard CM vs CG/CJ had more to do with documentation standardization than the airplanes themselves. Servicing black 40 and 50 required having two complete libraries of technical orders which is a lot.


    With CM one set of TOs apply to all modern F-16s (not sure if that includes ANG earlier than 40) which greatly simplifies and unifies things. I'm not sure if there's any particular thing you have to do to make a CJ into a CM physically.

    That would be irrelevant, as of 2012 (last year I work on the aircraft) only a few books where affected by the CCIP update. A dozen books hardly matter in libraries containing hundreds of books in this specific context.


  14. 2 hours ago, Tholozor said:

    Only typo in that post is the engines are reversed on the block designations (should be blocks 30/40/50 have the GE; 32/42/52 have the P&W).


    3 hours ago, skywalker22 said:

    Another thing, as with the blocks 30/32, 40/42, and 50/52, blocks 30, 40, and 50 are equiped with General Electric engines. Blocks 32, 42, and 52 are equiped with Pratt&Whittney engines.

    The purpose of this is two fold 1. It is cheaper with two competing engine manufacturers and you also usually get the best product although most of us will tell you that GE is by far the better engine 2. It is an insurance policy. For instance, if the whole fleet of F-16s was equipped with Pratt engines and Pratt found a safety problem and had to ground the whole fleet to fix the problem... your screwed. By having two different engines ensures this doesn't happen.




    The F-16 have used 6 different engines with many subversion, not 2. Block 1 to 25 used F100-PW-200. Later block 32 and 42 used F100-PW-220. Early blocks where updated to F100-PW-220 and some users updated their PW-200 to PW-220 standards, those are called F100-PW-220E. Now IIRC, 2 units have converted their block 42 to F100-PW-229 ( Toledo ANG and Oklahoma ANG)

    Now, block 30 and 40 used the F110-GE-100, Block 50 uses the F110-GE-129, Block 52 use the F100-PW-229 and the block 60 use the F110-GE-132


    There where many test aircraft, some with controllable nozzle for thrust vectoring and at least one with the J79

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  15. 3 hours ago, skywalker22 said:

    The easiest way to distinguish the earlier block 5, 10, and 15 A/B models in my opinion is to look at the stabs. The earlier models had a sharoly angled corner on the outside rear corner of the stabs. On subsequent blocks this corner is cut off.





    That is not the best way to tell early blocks apart since many early blocks have the updated horizontal stabs. We talk about here

    The early models (block 1 to 20) will have the smaller base for the vertical stab and smaller landing gear. There are many more external differences (RWR and other antennas locations, floods lights etc.) But the landing gear and vertical tail are the most common.


    Anyway, the corner was not cut, the entire horizontal stabs are bigger (more area)

  16. On 2/13/2019 at 11:31 PM, mvsgas said:


    I tried to explain this here



    To add, CM it would be found on Technical Orders (T.O.) Specifically affected after CCIP program (i.e. 1F-16CM-34-1-1, 1F-16CM-1, etc.) For other T.O. is would still be CJ (block 50/52) or CG (block 40/42). CM does not specify a block or capabilities and it is still officially F-16C but it becoming common practice to refer to those F-16 after CCIP upgrade as CM.

    So when you look at the cover page of a 1F-16CM-34-1-1, it refers to the aircraft as a F-16C/D because that is the official designation.



    For those that are interested, Air Force Instruction (AFI) 11-2F-16V3 is available online in E-publishing.af.mil. It has no publishing restrictions and has a lot of information regarding F-16 operations.


    For example, it has been brought up before that the HUD in a F-16 is not a primary flight instrument.



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  17. 1 hour ago, Gunfreak said:

    Wiki gave me no answers, sure it makes many refrences to Block 50, 40 and 52 ect. But dosn't say what they are.

    Blocks are a manufacturing label indicating a baseline for the aircraft, but it's rarely used in other aircraft besides the F-16. It's been used for years, even WWII aircraft had blocks. On the F-16 it is incorrectly used by people to define capabilities. This is incorrect because F-16 are in a constant state of upgrade/update and there are block 52 less capable than a block 20.

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