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-   -   New Damage Model irrelevant if... (https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=243587)

DD_Fenrir 06-18-2019 01:17 PM

New Damage Model irrelevant if...
 
...The AI is not able to integrate with it.

Given that this is currently possible:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cv5uJuhLkBI

(for the TL;DR crowd a Player P-51 denudes an AI 109K-4 of BOTH ailerons and it's rudder yet somehow it still manages to maintain full lateral manoueverabilty and ultimately bests the P-51 guy)

What assurances do we have that this sort of complete disconnect between the AI behaviour and the physical airworthiness of the AI aircraft will not simply be carried forward into the New Damage model?

I've been singing the praises of DCS and trying to support the branching to WW2 era for sometime now and I knew the AI had these issues but seeing this vid and just brings home how ludicrous it is considering that even 20 years ago we didn't see this kind of disconnect in WW2 combat flight sims.

Surely the process of tying in a the loss of even one major control surface with a "disengage & evade" routine - as I think most of us here would agree, is the only sensible course of action we'd take in a similar circumstance - is, if not simple, at least achievable, yet 6 years after the P-51 was released...

I'm a loyal and paying customer ED, whose repeatedly demonstrated his willing to overlook a few bumps and bugs on the road to development but I'm starting to get the feeling I'm being played.

Change my mind.

Hunter Joker 06-18-2019 01:22 PM

The AI must be fixed, is starting to be a "too big" problem to be ignored, actually PvE and SP missions are a pain...

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QuiGon 06-18-2019 01:25 PM

Many people fly in multiplayer, so the new DM would not be irrelevant if it would not apply to the AI.

grafspee 06-18-2019 01:25 PM

new dm model isnt released yet and it will be implemented for AI too

Hunter Joker 06-18-2019 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuiGon (Post 3953796)
Many people fly in multiplayer, so the new DM would not be irrelevant if it would not apply to the AI.

Many is not all and probably nor the majority... With my Squadron I play pvp and even pve... Sometimes sp... Pretending the AI fixed when there are other products on the market that have a decent AI is not a kid's cry, is a loyal customer (own pratically all the modules apart the Heli and 3 or 4 airplanes, all the maps, CA and so on..) that want something for wich I payed usable in all the possible contest...[emoji106]
Forgive my bad English...

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Whisper 06-18-2019 01:41 PM

DM AND AI are the 2 reasons I never end up playing DCS WWII, Both need fixing, not just one.
Sorry for the PvP MP crowd but AI is as important as DM

DD_Fenrir 06-18-2019 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuiGon (Post 3953796)
Many people fly in multiplayer, so the new DM would not be irrelevant if it would not apply to the AI.

For a PvP airquake server, you would be correct.

But anytime you introduce AI, be it in fighter or bomber aircraft, either in Multiplayer matches to flesh out historical scenarios PvP+E or as an absolute pre-requisite for Single player Air-to-Air then we run up against this issue.

To dismiss is at as only affecting SP is a) disingenuous and b) doesn't satisfy those of us who want a fulfilling SP/MP experience with the AI - which I suspect is a considerably greater number than the exclusively Airquake crowd.

QuiGon 06-18-2019 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DD_Fenrir (Post 3953811)
For a PvP airquake server, you would be correct.

But anytime you introduce AI, be it in fighter or bomber aircraft, either in Multiplayer matches to flesh out historical scenarios PvP+E or as an absolute pre-requisite for Single player Air-to-Air then we run up against this issue.

To dismiss is at as only affecting SP is a) disingenuous and b) doesn't satisfy those of us who want a fulfilling SP/MP experience with the AI - which I suspect is a considerably greater number than the exclusively Airquake crowd.

I fully agree. I just said it wouldn't be totally irrelevant if it would not apply to the AI. Having a new DM for players only is still better than having no new DM at all.

Shahdoh 06-18-2019 01:59 PM

Can't find the thread at the moment, but I could have sworn Nineline said it was intended to apply to the AI as well somewhere along the line.

NineLine 07-15-2019 04:40 PM

AI will have the same DM, would not make sense otherwise.


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