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-   -   Any possibility for a Invincible class carrier? (https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=256000)

[Maverick] 11-26-2019 02:20 AM

Any possibility for a Invincible class carrier?
 
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015...4912573862.jpg

With Falklands in the works, is there any possibility to see anInvincible class carrier in future?

Harlikwin 11-26-2019 02:31 AM

Well there is a mod...

But yes an official "ski jump" ship would be better... Preferably one that operated the NA version, if any... Caveour maybe?

Lordzarj 11-26-2019 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [Maverick] (Post 4117934)
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015...4912573862.jpg

With Falklands in the works, is there any possibility to see anInvincible class carrier in future?

Your picture is of HMS Hermes a Centaur class carrier. Razbam have shown WIP images of the Invincible class so we should be good on that front in due course.

A user mod of Hermes already exists.

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=209539

Hawkeye_UK 11-27-2019 03:09 AM

As per above get the Hermes Mod its brilliant for the harrier also allows greater take off weight as you would expect so more bombs on target!

[Maverick] 11-27-2019 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lordzarj (Post 4118524)
Razbam have shown WIP images of the Invincible class so we should be good on that front in due course.


Not interested in mods (but it looks awesome tho) I'm holding out to get it in the actual game so we can use it on public servers :)

Do you have a link for the Razbam pics of the WIP carrier sir?

Lordzarj 11-27-2019 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [Maverick] (Post 4118782)
Do you have a link for the Razbam pics of the WIP carrier sir?

Sure, try these near the bottom of the page.

https://razbamsimulations.com/index....errain-project

There were some on their Facebook page too but I’m not a Facebook user so can’t search there.

[Maverick] 11-27-2019 04:42 PM

Awesome thank you sir!

God speed, RAZBAM Simulations!

Harlikwin 11-27-2019 05:42 PM

Yup its a nice page, but those posts are pretty old. I wouldn't hold my breath for a release any time soon..

TLTeo 11-28-2019 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harlikwin (Post 4117942)
Well there is a mod...

But yes an official "ski jump" ship would be better... Preferably one that operated the NA version, if any... Caveour maybe?


The Cavour (or the Giuseppe Garibaldi before it) did not operate the NA version, just the AV8B+ to my knowledge.


But of course, I would be all for it :pilotfly::thumbup:

Harlikwin 11-28-2019 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TLTeo (Post 4120541)
The Cavour (or the Giuseppe Garibaldi before it) did not operate the NA version, just the AV8B+ to my knowledge.


But of course, I would be all for it :pilotfly::thumbup:

I dont think anyone outside the USMC operated the NA off ships. The gr. 5 IIRC is the closest variant bit that wasnt operated off carriers go my knowledge.

Lordzarj 11-29-2019 07:10 AM

The GR.7 and GR.9 are the NA equivalents, the GR.5 had no FLIR and was roughly the same as the base AV-8B other than the ECM and some avionics.

The GR.7 and 9 both flew off the Invincible class initially alongside the Sea Harrier FA.2 and after its retirement.

Harlikwin 11-29-2019 11:33 PM

Hm i thought the 9 had a radar and was more like the av8b+

Lordzarj 11-30-2019 07:25 AM

No, none of the RAF Harriers ever had a radar, unless you count the altimeter of course ;)

The Royal Navy Sea Harriers did, the Sea Harrier FA.2 had the Blue Vixen Radar and AMRAAM which was somewhat equivalent to the Plus in capability, but the airframe, wings etc. were from the original Harrier generation, there was also no TGP or FLIR so they were very different aircraft.

Sea Harrier FA.2

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...2367186%29.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...arrier_FA2.jpg

Harrier GR.9

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...0819125%29.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._Lofting-1.jpg

Richard Dastardly 12-01-2019 03:25 PM

The SHAR 2 radar was a properly developed AI radar - not sure if that had any A/G mode like the II+ ex-Hornet radar does, it certainly had look-down over land which was a long way in advance of the SHAR 1 radar which was a modified Seaspray anti-ship radar from the Lynx, of all things. It was only intended to spot larger targets & being originally anti-ship at least worked reasonably at sea... unfortunately it was very rushed. The SHAR 2 Blue Vixen radar became Typhoon's CAPTOR ( somewhat ), so I doubt we're seeing that anytime soon.

To round it up the Indian SHAR1s operating from ex-Hermes got upgraded with an Israeli AA/AG radar.

Reading a Falklands book at the moment ( Hostile Skies ), it seems the GR3 could laser designate - presumably with a fixed laser. I was always under the impression they could just receive, so did the GRx also have a spot designator?

Hermes mod is well worth a look - unfortunately you can't spawn on it yet though. Regardless of that it's another deck to fly off.

Edit: Blue Vixen did have air-to-surface capability.

Harlikwin 12-01-2019 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lordzarj (Post 4122155)
No, none of the RAF Harriers ever had a radar, unless you count the altimeter of course ;)

The Royal Navy Sea Harriers did, the Sea Harrier FA.2 had the Blue Vixen Radar and AMRAAM which was somewhat equivalent to the Plus in capability, but the airframe, wings etc. were from the original Harrier generation, there was also no TGP or FLIR so they were very different aircraft.

Sea Harrier FA.2

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...2367186%29.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...arrier_FA2.jpg

Harrier GR.9

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...0819125%29.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._Lofting-1.jpg

Thanks for enlightening me. I thought the at least one of the gr. versions was the sea harrier. Guess not :)

Harlikwin 12-01-2019 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dastardly (Post 4123350)
Hermes mod is well worth a look - unfortunately you can't spawn on it yet though. Regardless of that it's another deck to fly off.

Used to be able to spawn on it, did that change recently?

Lordzarj 12-01-2019 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dastardly (Post 4123350)
Reading a Falklands book at the moment ( Hostile Skies ), it seems the GR3 could laser designate - presumably with a fixed laser. I was always under the impression they could just receive, so did the GRx also have a spot designator?

I don’t believe so, the device in the nose of the GR.3 was known as the Laser Ranger and Marked Target Seeker, so whilst it could emit it was only in terms of ranging as far as I am aware. It would be pretty inaccurate (and dangerous in combat) to have to point the whole aircraft at the target I would imagine. The marked target seeker would be somewhat like LSS on the ARBS although without the camera, perhaps Pave Penny on the A-10A is a better match. The LRMTS was also used on the Jaguar and Tornado.

I’ve read Hostile Skies but it was a while ago, how is it worded? I thought that all GBU drops in the Falklands were ground designated. Happy to be wrong on all counts though!

Edit: just found this looking for more info on LRMTS, it has nice details on the Falklands GBU drops and says they tried to guide the bombs with the laser ranger on one occasion but it wasn’t compatible with Paveway (you would think they would have known that beforehand).

https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightP...20-%202627.PDF

Richard Dastardly 12-01-2019 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harlikwin (Post 4123443)
Used to be able to spawn on it, did that change recently?

Last few times I tried I've just fallen overboard on spawn, but admittedly I don't think I've tried since the last round of carrier fixes. Might have something to do with being in motion also.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Lordzarj (Post 4123497)
I don’t believe so, the device in the nose of the GR.3 was known as the Laser Ranger and Marked Target Seeker, so whilst it could emit it was only in terms of ranging as far as I am aware. It would be pretty inaccurate (and dangerous in combat) to have to point the whole aircraft at the target I would imagine. The marked target seeker would be somewhat like LSS on the ARBS although without the camera, perhaps Pave Penny on the A-10A is a better match. The LRMTS was also used on the Jaguar and Tornado.

I’ve read Hostile Skies but it was a while ago, how is it worded? I thought that all GBU drops in the Falklands were ground designated. Happy to be wrong on all counts though!

Edit: just found this looking for more info on LRMTS, it has nice details on the Falklands GBU drops and says they tried to guide the bombs with the laser ranger on one occasion but it wasn’t compatible with Paveway (you would think they would have known that beforehand).

https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightP...20-%202627.PDF

Pointing the aircraft at the target isn't really any different to using unguided rockets, and back then don't forget most attacks were done at very low level so getting close to the target wasn't so frowned on as today ( in 1982 manpad threat was also tiny ); additionally the Harrier has the worlds best dive brake if you wanted to point from altitude! however yeah, they wanted to bomb Stanley from high level because of the local Roland system & weren't having any luck until they got some Paveway kits, reading between the lines they seem to have got the kits and what amounts to advertising blurb rather than a manual... I guess the thought process went "well, we have a laser on the aircraft, so..."

But yes, as compatible as the Ka-50 for us to have buddy lasing. Would have been an interesting if desperate field mod to make it compatible somehow :p

joey45 12-03-2019 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dastardly (Post 4123350)

Hermes mod is well worth a look - unfortunately you can't spawn on it yet though. Regardless of that it's another deck to fly off.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dastardly (Post 4123555)
Last few times I tried I've just fallen overboard on spawn, but admittedly I don't think I've tried since the last round of carrier fixes. Might have something to do with being in motion also.


Thanks for telling me... :thumbup:

Holbeach 12-03-2019 02:57 PM

The Harrier spawns on the Stbd quarter for me perfectly well and always has done.


Bow spawn for the 72 version or 4 choppers.


..

Richard Dastardly 12-04-2019 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey45 (Post 4125314)
Thanks for telling me... :thumbup:

I thought I'd brought it up in the mod thread already actually - apologies.

Harlikwin 12-04-2019 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holbeach (Post 4125462)
The Harrier spawns on the Stbd quarter for me perfectly well and always has done.


Bow spawn for the 72 version or 4 choppers.


..

I've had no issues spawning in the harrier or the F14 on either the 73 or 81 versions as of yesterday...

RFC Rudel 12-07-2019 02:06 PM

https://nhacmp3youtube.com/video/bjpgSEPk1TY.html


radar on 82 harriers, by veteran pilots

Richard Dastardly 12-07-2019 05:17 PM

Sharkey Ward has a bit of a mixed reputation...

Was interesting reading about the rivalry( not all good natured ) between the two carriers, and how the Hermes crews seem to get more out of the radar than the Invincible ones.

RFC Rudel 12-08-2019 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dastardly (Post 4131317)
Sharkey Ward has a bit of a mixed reputation...

Was interesting reading about the rivalry( not all good natured ) between the two carriers, and how the Hermes crews seem to get more out of the radar than the Invincible ones.



from what I heard it was not welcome in the raf how he finish the shutdown of the c 130 when it was about to make a sea landing. but that's old history.

RFC Rudel 12-08-2019 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lordzarj (Post 4123497)
I don’t believe so, the device in the nose of the GR.3 was known as the Laser Ranger and Marked Target Seeker, so whilst it could emit it was only in terms of ranging as far as I am aware. It would be pretty inaccurate (and dangerous in combat) to have to point the whole aircraft at the target I would imagine. The marked target seeker would be somewhat like LSS on the ARBS although without the camera, perhaps Pave Penny on the A-10A is a better match. The LRMTS was also used on the Jaguar and Tornado.

I’ve read Hostile Skies but it was a while ago, how is it worded? I thought that all GBU drops in the Falklands were ground designated. Happy to be wrong on all counts though!

Edit: just found this looking for more info on LRMTS, it has nice details on the Falklands GBU drops and says they tried to guide the bombs with the laser ranger on one occasion but it wasn’t compatible with Paveway (you would think they would have known that beforehand).

https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightP...20-%202627.PDF



I have see picture and read about the llaser guided bombs, and not always can they fly low, there was a Oerlikon skyguard that protect a 300meters bouble. the laser guided bombs was used during the ninght attacks.

Pikey 12-10-2019 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dastardly (Post 4131317)
Sharkey Ward has a bit of a mixed reputation...

Was interesting reading about the rivalry( not all good natured ) between the two carriers, and how the Hermes crews seem to get more out of the radar than the Invincible ones.


Well you call the Admiral an idiot and it does wonders for your career :D I believe the same system applies these days too, such is how sycophants do OK. Personally, anyone that stands up to be counted and knows their own mind has a great quality.
-----

As for the manner he conducted his warfare, I don't think it's worth judging humans who acted in life or death situations, from armchairs: The Herc and crew had a difficult task of resuplying equipment to Argentinian ground forces on the Falklands. There's simply no mandate for 'clipping wings, playing laser tag or deciding who won other than the ultimate sacrifice. Landing with a fire or not does not stop it's mission. Unfortunately war is decided by the killing of people. It does not decide who is Right. Only who is Left.


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