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-   -   The Battle of the Stretch Goal (https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=114788)

hegykc 09-29-2013 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royraiden (Post 1889774)
Well at least after honoring the backers that were promised the 3 initial flyables, I think it is a great idea to indeed just offer one flyable afterwards.

Wait, that's a possibility? Within kickstarter rules?

That would be a no brainer then, I would be forced to pledge immediately.

Royraiden 09-29-2013 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hegykc (Post 1889784)
Wait, that's a possibility? Within kickstarter rules?

That would be a no brainer then, I would be forced to pledge immediately.

Maybe I didnt explain my thoughts clearly,promising 3 aircraft to backers and then only giving them one is NOT what I meant.Im talking about the final product offerings for the general public ie. those who didnt pledge during the Kickstarter.

MACADEMIC 09-29-2013 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hegykc (Post 1889784)
Wait, that's a possibility? Within kickstarter rules?

That would be a no brainer then, I would be forced to pledge immediately.

From the Kickstarter guidelines it seems entirely possible to change the goals of a project during a campaign. You can't change the rewards once you have some pledges for them, but reversing on the promise to deliver a free game and airplanes could be entirely changed. I think it would be a not only smart, but vital move for the project.

MAC

hegykc 09-29-2013 09:08 PM

Yeah, so backers get 3 for free. Anybody downloading the final release gets 1. Better yet, make that free one with some limitations.

That would make me, and a lot of others, pledge immediately!

The only ones that would get mad about that, are the ones that have no interest in paying ever. I'm sure it wouldn't bother a single supporter.

mazex 09-29-2013 09:10 PM

OK, if Paypal is not to costy/complex to add that obviously is something many have been talking about... But I would definitely go the path of having only free one plane in the initial release! I would have liked to have a Harvard (usable for realistic training missions) or a C-47 (actually important for the D-Day setting - and it could be sold for $39 or so in DCS world as a DC-3 to drag some old FSX guys that way).

But - as you have the plane set ready I'd say have the P-47 as free then... Why? It's cool looking but "from the man on the street" it would not be choice number one, and who would not like to have a Spitfire after a while... And a 109 to match it? I guess some people would be content with just the Spitfire and the 109 and even skip the P-47. So have that one as free and the "ladder" in rewards you proposed sounds good!

And regarding upsetting the fence sitters that wait to get 3 planes for free I guess they understand that it was too generous anyway?

Good luck! /mazex

Royraiden 09-29-2013 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hegykc (Post 1889793)
Yeah, so backers get 3 for free. Anybody downloading the final release gets 1. Better yet, make that free one with some limitations.

That would make me, and a lot of others, pledge immediately!

Im pretty sure it was a mistake, but when you have people giving you their money while being promised they will get something and then you give them less than promised, that would be a low blow and could hurt the reputation of the team.Now as I said, after the kickstarter, if there is another crowd funding or simply the final product offering we cant have 3 flyables for free.

SlipBall 09-29-2013 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royraiden (Post 1889796)
I dont think thats a good idea.Im pretty sure it was a mistake, but when you have people giving you their money while being promised they will get something and then you give them less than promised, that would be a low blow and could hurt the reputation of the team.Now as I said, after the kickstarter, if there is another crowd funding or simply the final product offering we cant have 3 flyables for free.


and is a strong incentive for those still on the fence, to grab the planes within the 5 remaining days

Pizzicato 09-29-2013 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyJWest (Post 1889762)
Luthier, my honest answer - as someone still undecided how much I can justify pledging on a very limited budget - has to be that making wholesale changes at this late stage doesn't really inspire confidence. If the 'three free planes' proposal isn't financially viable, then clearly it will have to go - but I can't see how doing this would result in increased Kickstarter funding.

I tend to agree.

As it stands I see several obstacles, most of which are pretty much insurmountable at this stage:

1. There have been a few high profile Kickstarter debacles in the news recently which may have shaken people's confidence in this whole business model:

2. Many people in the community still feel burnt by the Cliffs of Dover experience. The rights, wrongs and details of what actually occurred are unimportant compared to people's individual perceptions of what happened. Some people (like myself) are willing to give you another shot. Many others are not. This may be unfair and frustrating, but it's an unavoidable truth.

3. Many people that are on the fence (especially those that are distrustful after the issues around Cliffs of Dover) aren't going to commit until they see something tangible that they can buy into. As it stands, you have little more than words and good intentions to offer. This isn't going to be enough to move those that are sitting on the fence.

4. The frequent changes of focus (first you were going for a brand new audience, then you shifted to the hardcore), the increasingly complex/confusing pledge rewards, the indecisiveness over stretch goals, the rather amateurish videos and the general lack of communication with the community make the whole endeavour seem rather unprofessional and poorly thought out.

I don't mean any of this to sound nasty or personal (I really, really don't), but it's very pertinent to the issue at hand. Whatever the rights and wrongs of it, there are concerns around your ability to deliver what you promise and the execution of the Kickstarter to date has arguably done more to reinforce those worries than address them.

I don't see these "trust issues" as something that can easily be addressed in the near future. Your best bet from my perspective is to focus on "right sizing" the project and then executing on it to a very high degree of quality. If you can do this in addition to having a coherent, workable long term financial strategy, you'll begin to win the doubters back and make money in the process.

I would absolutely start by giving just ONE free aircraft with the initial launch of DCS: WII. You're looking to entice people into your world, not give the whole thing away for free.

Regardless - best of luck with the endeavour. I really hope you can make it work in terms of both quality and revenue. :thumbup:

Royraiden 09-29-2013 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GT 5.0 (Post 1889799)
and is a strong incentive for those still on the fence, to grab the planes within the 5 remaining days

Of course it would, my main concern is that even if explained properly and in depth a lot of backers will simply start complaining thinking that they wouldnt get the promised 3 flyables.So I keep suggesting that we let the project be as it is and start restructuring right after it closes and the money is secure.

hegykc 09-29-2013 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royraiden (Post 1889796)
Im pretty sure it was a mistake, but when you have people giving you their money while being promised they will get something and then you give them less than promised, that would be a low blow and could hurt the reputation of the team.Now as I said, after the kickstarter, if there is another crowd funding or simply the final product offering we cant have 3 flyables for free.

No promises would be broken to people that gave money. They get their 3 planes for "free", of for their pledge.

The only promise broken would be to anyone that hasn't pledged.

I'm pretty sure these modules make more than 200.000$ revenue in the first year. And WWII ones would do much better. So with 3 free ones, you're basically giving away a cool million of development money.


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