Pilot Body Update from Aug, 18th

[IronMike]

We published an update for the pilot body in August only on our facebook page, without linking it here, now I see that some were not aware of it, so here is a repost for everyone on the forums to see. We will have more detailed updates in the future, the -A release takes top priority at the moment.

 

In the meantime, please do not dispair, the pilot bodies will come as promised, please keep in mind they take longer for us to do because of level of detail, animations, etc... hence we said from the get go they would come towards the end of EA. That said, we are fully aware how much wanted they are, it is one of the most commonly expressed wishes. We will do our best to bring them asap.

 

From the update, Aug 18th 2020 (please note that this was just a small WIP update):

 

"New pilot sculpts for DCS F-14 (for the cockpit and eventually exterior) and the A-6 family coming along! This upgrade will also include the more modern HGU-55 and the MBU-5/p mask for older -A liveries and Iranian Tomcats."

 

 

[westr]

We published an update for the pilot body in August only on our facebook page, without linking it here, now I see that some were not aware of it, so here is a repost for everyone on the forums to see. We will have more detailed updates in the future, the -A release takes top priority at the moment.

 

In the meantime, please do not dispair, the pilot bodies will come as promised, please keep in mind they take longer for us to do because of level of detail, animations, etc... hence we said from the get go they would come towards the end of EA. That said, we are fully aware how much wanted they are, it is one of the most commonly expressed wishes. We will do our best to bring them asap.

 

From the update, Aug 18th 2020 (please note that this was just a small WIP update):

 

"New pilot sculpts for DCS F-14 (for the cockpit and eventually exterior) and the A-6 family coming along! This upgrade will also include the more modern HGU-55 and the MBU-5/p mask for older -A liveries and Iranian Tomcats."

 

 

Ok great to see its being worked on. Just to clarify this will not come in the October patch? but towards the end of the year where you expect to be nearing the end of EA?

[IronMike]

Or beginning next year, really cant say, as it is not such a straight forward task. We expect to be out of EA for the 2 year anniversary, so around march 2021. But we will try our best to bring you the pilot body before that. I just want to be careful with promises.

[westr]

Or beginning next year, really cant say, as it is not such a straight forward task. We expect to be out of EA for the 2 year anniversary, so around march 2021. But we will try our best to bring you the pilot body before that. I just want to be careful with promises.

 

Ok thanks for the info.

[Swordsman422]

The MS22001 was a much more common mask on 1970's F-14s than the MBU-5.

 

The new model is looking good. I'll be excited to have the modern low profile visor setup.

[LanceCriminal86]

The MS22001 was a much more common mask on 1970's F-14s than the MBU-5.

 

The new model is looking good. I'll be excited to have the modern low profile visor setup.

 

Man I wrote this whole thing up and went off to go do more research, then it dawned on me: It's very possible that HB are working off some helmets either donated or from museum pics they were provided during the research phase, or maybe even one of the SME's helmets.

 

Based on that I can see where it's possible they have HGU 33 or 55 with an MBU-5 for reference, even though the general consensus is that MS22001 and MBU 12 or 14 would have been the most common masks across the late 70s through 1990s.

 

For the TLDR: I think the HGU-55 seems to be more common with the MBU-14/p or maybe the Navy version of the MBU-12/P, and the HGU-33 probably should stick with the MS22001, or if you really feel like changing it, also using an MBU-14/P

 

______

 

Interesting, seeing that mostly the HGU-33 and -55 were used with USN version of MBU-12, or MBU-14.

 

It seems helmets and masks were somewhat all over the place for the entire period depicted in the Tomcat module, from the late 70s through the 90s. Lots of the old APH-6 helmets upgraded to HGU-33 style, various types of mask mounting solutions and masks themselves, were used into the 80s. I guess if they still worked and had the same features as the HGU-33, why replace it?

 

There's photos around of VF-84 from the Final Countdown in 1979 with modified APH-6Es. Funnily enough one does have a MBU-5 and another has MS22001. Apparently they were still using them into the 80s. And even into the 80s-90s, there's helmets that look like HGU-55s but they're actually just 33s with the bungee visors and ears added. But, as you pointed out seeing more references to the MBU-12 and 14 family instead of MBU-5, and the MS22001 like you said.

 

I don't know how authoritative this guy's site is, but he seems to have done quite a bit of work. I like to reference it mainly for helmet designs, but also when looking for options when finding various helmets online to buy/goof off with, or even restore. I have an old APH-6D I think that needs quite a bit of work. No idea what squadron it came from but hoping I can find out someday.

 

http://www.salimbeti.com/aviation/helmets3.htm

[Swordsman422]

Actually, to add to what you've said, the MS22001 was commonly used with the APH-6, both with butterfly bayonets and with the rare swing-a-line bayonets. The MBU-5 was used occasionally, but it was much less common. At viewing scale, the APH-6 and HGU-33 wold be almost indistinguishable, especially if it's an APH-6E modified with cast bayo receivers. By 1983, the combination was solidly HGU-33/MBU-14, with the MBU-14 being green. By the time low-profile helmets (as you saw, modified HGU-33s or stock HGU-55s) started hitting the fleet, you wouldn't really see MBU-5s in Tomcats. Some of the green MBU-14s might still be hanging on around the late 1980s, but they were typically grey by this point (except the hoses. Early grey dyes would cause the hoses to deteriorate, so by the time a mask had it's first service inspection, the grey hose was replaced with a green one.).

 

As for mask mounting, I can say exactly why they moved away from either the butterfly bayonets or the swing-a-lines; they didn't make for strong connections. I've pulled a 22001 off an APH helmet with a firm enough tug, and I'm not a strong guy. A high-g turn could see that mask in your lap. The existing bayonet system is a lot better at maintaining connection, with the movement from cast to lightweight receivers mainly driven by weight savings.

 

I actually know Andreas Salimbeti. He and I are members of the same ASE Facebook group and he's one of a handful of guys who are main reference sources for flight equipment. He knows his stuff, so you can put money on his site being accurate. There might be two other guys in the FB group who know more than he does, but those guys were rated ASEs whose careers spanned several periods of gear changes. You can trust him.

 

Shoot me some images of that helmet. Maybe I can ID it for you or find someone who can.

[LanceCriminal86]

I'll send those pics to you, heck maybe I can hop in that FB group? I'd love to find more helmet references for skinning, since there seems to be a lot of variations each squadron went through over the years and not all the time were they identical.

 

For me I think just having the separate HGU-33 and HGU-55 will more than satisfy me, I hadn't even looked at the masks but I knew some guys have recolored/skinned them to represent the newer versions. It does seem like the broadest coverage would be -33 with MS22001 and -55 with MBU-14

[Looney]

The pilot looks a bit like Buck Danny

[IronMike]

The pilot looks a bit like Buck Danny

 

 

 

 

we're still growing his moustache.

[RaisedByWolves]

I figured the pilot modeled was Victory205

[Reflected]

we're still growing his moustache.

 

I sure hope he'll have one, otherwise I'll ask for a refund! :D

[IronMike]

I sure hope he'll have one, otherwise I'll ask for a refund! :D

 

 

 

 

literally unplayable :D

[LanceCriminal86]

@IronMike

 

I know you guys are probably tired of some of these requests, but regarding the new pilot models:

 

1) Can the Pilot and Rio have separate textures? The helmets are currently split which is nice, but pilots and RIOs have different wings, and often actual pilots and RIOs wore different patches, say if one was a Top Gun grad.

 

2) Out of respect for such important Naval Aviators as ENS Jesse Brown and all who followed him, can we at least have the pilot templated in a way to represent all of the Pilots and RIOs who mounted up in Tomcats, if you catch my drift? As well as to help portray the Iranian crews more accurately?

[IronMike]

I'm sure pilot and rio will be distinct in where they have to be, judging Cobra's eye for detail, I don't even need to ask him about that, hehe.

 

As for the color of the pilot. I am not sure we would want or could change the whole modeling again, judging by the pictures Cobra is going for caucasian. In general we'd be happy to have more diverse pilots/ RIOs. Maybe at some point we could offer an option for that even, not sure how much work such changes are, the guess is: a lot. So I will be careful and say, please don't expect us to go into that direction for now. At the same time, rest assured we'd have the highest regards for ENS Jesse Brown manning our aircraft. This btw also goes for female aviators, the times where only the caucasian male represents aviation are long gone.

 

While it may be too late now, we'll keep that in mind for the future as well. Thank you for the suggestion. Just on a sidenote: anything that furthers diversity and inclusivity, is something we have always open ears for.

Edited September 16, 2020 by IronMike

[LanceCriminal86]

It was just something that dawned on me while researching some skins and watching Tomcat interviews and such. I was doing a "heritage" livery of ENS Brown and LtJG Hudner's markings from their Corsairs for VF-32 and the thought crossed my mind.

 

If a pilot/RIO template could be released with skin separate in different layers I think that more than handles the situation for most of us.

[IronMike]

It was just something that dawned on me while researching some skins and watching Tomcat interviews and such. I was doing a "heritage" livery of ENS Brown and LtJG Hudner's markings from their Corsairs for VF-32 and the thought crossed my mind.

 

If a pilot/RIO template could be released with skin separate in different layers I think that more than handles the situation for most of us.

 

 

 

 

I'll ask Cobra what we can do about it. :)

[Steve Gee]

Sort of pilot related. Is there a change planned/mentioned for the helmets to have different textures for the Pilot/RIO in all LOD's?

 

Or, is that just a Top Gun movie thing and they all had the same look in Fleet service?

[draconus]

Have you decided on the hand covering some switch problem? Is it simple body on/off, ghost/transparent at cursor or fully animated hand up?

[Swordsman422]

Sort of pilot related. Is there a change planned/mentioned for the helmets to have different textures for the Pilot/RIO in all LOD's?

 

Or, is that just a Top Gun movie thing and they all had the same look in Fleet service?

 

By the time the F-14 was in the fleet aside the occasional zap decal and the callsign, squadron helmet art was pretty much standardized. Everyone from the skipper to the newest nugget in the squadron had the same helmet artwork as everyone else. Variation was and remains extremely minor.

 

That said, since this is a game and not real life, there's no reason why texture artists can't give the pilot and RIO different helmets. And we can. We just can't give the RIO a different body texture from the pilot, which would be nice.

[YSIAD_RIP]

Outstanding!

 

literally unplayable :D

 

Consider getting that Mustache in for November, a.k.a MOWVEMBER for Cancer Awareness and other issues.

 

According to Wikipedia:

Movember (a portmanteau of the Australian-English diminutive word for moustache, "mo",[1] and "November") is an annual event involving the growing of moustaches during the month of November to raise awareness of men's health issues, such as prostate cancer, testicular cancer, and men's suicide

[Steve Gee]

...

That said, since this is a game and not real life, there's no reason why texture artists can't give the pilot and RIO different helmets. And we can. We just can't give the RIO a different body texture from the pilot, which would be nice.

 

We can have different helmets until the view externally is zoomed out to the 2nd LOD level, then the LOD3_1 file takes over the helmet graphic rendering and it changes to have the same helmet for both pilots, as only one helmet texture file is rendered/assigned to the helmets..

[CarbonFox]

Wasn't the HGU-68 helmet standard by 1997 which the F-14A/B is modeled?

[Swordsman422]

Wasn't the HGU-68 helmet standard by 1997 which the F-14A/B is modeled?

 

In the typical configuration worn by F-14 crews, the HGU-68 is almost indistinguishable from the HGU-55. Stock, the -68 has a 600kt track visor, but this visor is incompatible with ANVIS systems, so was replaced with the same bungee visor as the HGU-55. You still did see the 600kt visor occasionally, but it was rare vs. the bungee visor.

[LanceCriminal86]

It'd be neat to have but HGU-55 and HGU-33 cover most of the bases. Doesn't mean I don't still want it in stock form for the final flight of VF-201's last Tomcat to AMARG:

 

VF-201 Last F-14 Flight 15 Nov 98-6 by NAS Fort Worth JRB, on Flickr