Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Gimbal roll discussion

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Gimbal roll discussion

    I don’t think this is a bug at this point, so I’d like to discuss when and why the TGP rolls the gimbal. It seems to do it a lot when I am close in to a target with a low dive angle. Anyone have strategies to avoid gimbal roll which makes the target become offset from the cursor?

    #2
    Yeah, it would be great to know what exactly it is, why and when occurs.
    To try to avoid it
    There is no description on the manual

    Comment


      #3
      i an not exactly sure either. though i have done maneuvers different ways while doing an external view to watch the pods optics. it seems to essentially get stuck trying to turn. like us turning our heads to look over our right shoulder then not know we can turn our head the other direction to continue the view arc. without boresight the fix is to set the tgp to stand by and then back to center it.
      AKA_SilverDevil

      ==========================================

      Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company.

      Mark Twain

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Renko View Post
        Yeah, it would be great to know what exactly it is, why and when occurs.
        To try to avoid it
        There is no description on the manual
        Has to do with roll limits on the head, before it basically has to unwind itself by reversing roll in the opposite direct.

        Yes, it is a real thing

        Comment


          #5
          I highly doubt it would be this bad in real life, at this point it messes up nearly half of the attack runs.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by gachatar View Post
            I highly doubt it would be this bad in real life, at this point it messes up nearly half of the attack runs.
            Never counted the actual degrees of allowed roll in game, but reducing the amount or roll has much to do with the person behind the aircraft controls as it does with the pod.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by silverdevil View Post
              i an not exactly sure either. though i have done maneuvers different ways while doing an external view to watch the pods optics. it seems to essentially get stuck trying to turn. like us turning our heads to look over our right shoulder then not know we can turn our head the other direction to continue the view arc. without boresight the fix is to set the tgp to stand by and then back to center it.
              It's literally like looking to the 3/4 o'clock position and up with a VR headset and then having the friggen cable getting struck by the chair's wheel preventing you from turning your head back forward. I really do hate that, and it happens a lot. There's a reason I bought a Quest... but DCS' framerate literally is down the drink with that res on my stone age rig.

              As for that happening in the A-10C, I usually get that when doing sharp turns at higher bank angles or even the thing which is called an Immelmann (which he never did since the E.III totally was not capable to pull that off, it literally was a hammerhead) after an attack run or a Split S to defeat some SAM. When sticking to 30° AoB orbits, it happens very rarely, but it did happen to me in the past while doing so. In that case I usually just STBY the thing and switch to A-G again and it comes back to life.

              What I'm really wondering now though is: Why does that never ever happen in the Hornet or Viper or even the Harrier (I guess in that very case, some of you "know" the answer) with the exact same pod?

              Comment


                #8
                Yeah, other aircraft with the same TGP should also suffer from this, the real thing is not capable of unlimited roll. One fun way of dealing with the issue is to do a quick aileron roll to "unwind" the TGP head. Of course, you need to have an idea which direction to roll in (or just make a good guess) to avoid making the problem worse. Resetting to boresight also helps, but it's not optimal if you're trying to track something.

                I also noticed that A-10's TGP loses track during violent maneuvers, particularly if you roll out too fast. The head can't follow the point and ends up off target. It seems that on this particular aircraft, it's far better modeled than on the others.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Dragon1-1 View Post
                  Yeah, other aircraft with the same TGP should also suffer from this, the real thing is not capable of unlimited roll. One fun way of dealing with the issue is to do a quick aileron roll to "unwind" the TGP head. Of course, you need to have an idea which direction to roll in (or just make a good guess) to avoid making the problem worse. Resetting to boresight also helps, but it's not optimal if you're trying to track something.

                  I also noticed that A-10's TGP loses track during violent maneuvers, particularly if you roll out too fast. The head can't follow the point and ends up off target. It seems that on this particular aircraft, it's far better modeled than on the others.
                  Not sure if it’s included in the A-10 software, but GIMB ROLL should be bracketed with <> arrows which denote which way you need to roll in order to clear the advisory. Could be a ‘wish list thing’ but not sure if there is intent to model that or not. Exists in other jets, not sure about this one.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Eldur View Post

                    What I'm really wondering now though is: Why does that never ever happen in the Hornet or Viper or even the Harrier (I guess in that very case, some of you "know" the answer) with the exact same pod?
                    It happens to me when doing gun runs in the Hornet with the TPOD on the left cheek station, and I'm fairly certain I've had it happen in the Harrier a couple times too. It doesn't seem as frequent as I remember in the old A-10C, and haven't tried in the A-10C II yet.
                    YouTube Channel: "Clutch"

                    Z390 Aorus Elite | i5-9600k @4.7Ghz | RTX2070 | 32GB DDR4 | Windows 10 | Odyssey Plus | Warthog HOTAS | 20cm Extension

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Eldur View Post
                      What I'm really wondering now though is: Why does that never ever happen in the Hornet or Viper or even the Harrier (I guess in that very case, some of you "know" the answer) with the exact same pod?

                      Exactly.
                      And without a description on the manual we dont know which parameters ED consider to enter gimbal roll

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Rainmaker View Post
                        Not sure if it’s included in the A-10 software, but GIMB ROLL should be bracketed with <> arrows which denote which way you need to roll in order to clear the advisory. Could be a ‘wish list thing’ but not sure if there is intent to model that or not. Exists in other jets, not sure about this one.
                        +1 this... but i too do not know if it is IRL. better to be closest to IRL.
                        AKA_SilverDevil

                        ==========================================

                        Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company.

                        Mark Twain

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I click stdby and then AG. Resets to boresight as well.
                          4930K @ 4.5, 32g ram, TitanPascal

                          Comment


                            #14
                            In the old DCS A-10C you can just press China Hat Aft Short to boresight the TGP if it is gimbaled. This makes the TGP to unwind itself. Now with the new A-10C we don't have the boresight command anymore and have to cycle to STDBY and back to AG or use some other workaround. Hopefully we will get the boresight OSB button that apparently exists in current real life A-10Cs.
                            Intel i7-4790K @ 4x4GHz + 16 GB DDR3 + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

                            DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

                            Comment


                              #15
                              If it really bothers you, you can make some autohotkey script that quickly presses OSB keybindings for TGP standby and AG and put that on your hotas.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                This started to get worse in the A-10C a couple years ago.


                                Now in the II, I often get a gimbal roll notifications as I'm turning towards the target, but when I roll out for the attack, it usually goes away and all is well.
                                Intel 9600K@4.9GHz, Asus Z390, 32GB DDR4 2400MHz, EVGA GTX 1070, Custom Water Cooling, 970 EVO 500GB NVMe, 2TB of Mechanical Storage

                                34" UltraWide 3440x1440 Curved Monitor, 21" MFD monitor, TIR5

                                My Pit Build, VKB Gunfighter Pro w/WH Grip, TMWH Throttle, MFG Crosswinds W/Combat Pedals, Cougar MFDs, Custom A-10C panels, Custom Helo Collective, SimShaker with Transducer

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by skypickle View Post
                                  I click stdby and then AG. Resets to boresight as well.
                                  I've done this as well...
                                  Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra, i7-9700k (4.9ghz all cores), NH-D15 cooler, 64 GB CL-14 3200mhz RAM, RTX3090FE, Soundblaster Z, Yamaha 5.1 A/V Receiver, 2x 512GB Samsung NVMe, 1x 1TB Samsung NVMe, WD 2TB HDD, Win 10 Pro, TM Warthog, Virpil WarBRD, MFG Crosswinds, 43" Samsung 4K TV, 21.5 Acer VT touchscreen, TrackIR, JetSeat KW-908, Reverb G2, Wheel Stand Pro Super Warthog, Phanteks Enthoo Pro Full Tower Case, Seasonic Prime 750W Titanium PW Supply, PointCTRL, Buttkicker 2

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    If one doesn't perform any barrel rolls, then the TPOD shouldn't get any cables tangled inside as it should basically be always using very limited scale from its whole gimbal limit.

                                    The low angle attack of course is similar thing, if aiming TPOD boresight below the target, then it can easily roll around its Z axis like one would be flying a aileron roll or barrel roll.

                                    So the guideline should be, avoid as much you can flying toward target with TPOD boresight below target.

                                    Another way to think about is that if your target will never get above your aircraft horizontal plane, then TPOD shouldn't be at all gimbal limited.
                                    i7-8700k, 32GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 2x 2080S SLI 8GB, Oculus Rift S.
                                    i7-8700k, 16GB 2666Mhz DDR4, 1080Ti 11GB, 27" 4K, 65" HDR 4K.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Rainmaker View Post
                                      Not sure if it’s included in the A-10 software, but GIMB ROLL should be bracketed with <> arrows which denote which way you need to roll in order to clear the advisory. Could be a ‘wish list thing’ but not sure if there is intent to model that or not. Exists in other jets, not sure about this one.
                                      IIRC, there is an arrow next to the GIMB ROLL warning. However, when I tried rolling in that direction, I don't recall it fixing the problem.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by jaylw314 View Post
                                        IIRC, there is an arrow next to the GIMB ROLL warning. However, when I tried rolling in that direction, I don't recall it fixing the problem.
                                        Roll in the opposite direction of the arrow. I've had limited success with this. I usually just standby the TGP and deploy it again.
                                        Intel 9600K@4.9GHz, Asus Z390, 32GB DDR4 2400MHz, EVGA GTX 1070, Custom Water Cooling, 970 EVO 500GB NVMe, 2TB of Mechanical Storage

                                        34" UltraWide 3440x1440 Curved Monitor, 21" MFD monitor, TIR5

                                        My Pit Build, VKB Gunfighter Pro w/WH Grip, TMWH Throttle, MFG Crosswinds W/Combat Pedals, Cougar MFDs, Custom A-10C panels, Custom Helo Collective, SimShaker with Transducer

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X