msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Pet peeves du jour: 1) The AI, particularly ground units, is dumb as bricks. Any plan to better those? 2) Belsimtek really should finish the choppers (as in taking care of omissions such as the missing Huey engine heat damage model etc.) before moving on. 3) The development in general has _really_ been back-and-forth wrt say missions containing any logic previously working well, but then not at all after an upgrade. Is this thing in a perpetual beta or what? 4) The moderation is too light-handed :megalol: (OK, that was a joke... maybe) Discuss - or ban :huh: The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 (edited) Pet peeves du jour: 1) The AI, particularly ground units, is dumb as bricks. Any plan to better those? 2) Belsimtek really should finish the choppers (as in taking care of omissions such as the missing Huey engine heat damage model etc.) before moving on. 3) The development in general has _really_ been back-and-forth wrt say missions containing any logic previously working well, but then not at all after an upgrade. Is this thing in a perpetual beta or what? 4) The moderation is too light-handed :megalol: (OK, that was a joke... maybe) Discuss - or ban :huh: Can I ban, then discuss so you cant answer and assume everything I said was believable :) 1) Game AI is dumb unless its heavily scripted, then its still dumb, but gets luckier at times... I hope as 2.0.0 develops, and the free up some CPU cycles we can see more action on the AI front. Also part of it has to be the current map was never really intended for as much ground action as we are throwing at it now... 2) Helicopters are based in witchcraft and for religious reasons (my Sith religion) I cant comment further. 3) Big things are coming with 2.0.0... so things are pretty messy in this house renovation... some of the stuff coming in 2 will hopefully clear things up more... 4) Moderators are generally jerks... specially that SiTh guy... where does he get off... He'll probably delete this post. Edited July 18, 2014 by NineLine Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Wags Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 (edited) 1- AI can always be improved, please feel free to list specific items in the AI problems sub forum. Oh wait, there must be no such thing because we do not allow any negative comments or complaints... 2- This is indeed planned but taking longer than expected. 3- DCS is never a static product wrapped up with a bow, it is ever expanding and at times working on one item may break another. 4- Sure, we can crack down more on users that cannot follow clearly stated forum rules and then complain we do not allow any negative posts ;) Edited July 18, 2014 by Wags 1 Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/user/wagmatt Twitch: wagmatt System: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=3729544#post3729544 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blooze Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 How 'bout we try something new this time and just let sleeping dogs lie. :music_whistling: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 Hah :D Thanks Wags. The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supersheep Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Now see what you did there! I've gotten used to see c0ff being dragged out of his caffeine-flooded cave, but you managed to get the big boss here. Run! :) Side-note (and not intended to annoy): Are "Edge" and "2.0" synonymous or is someone pulling another Duke here? The PVC Pipe Joystick Stand How to thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 EDGE is a part of 2.0.0 Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 1- AI can always be improved, please feel free to list specific items in the AI problems sub forum.Ah! But therein lies the rub, in that wrt AI it's actually a generic problem. The whole series has great promise, but some things such as the infantry not searching cover but just standing there while getting fired at is just daft. Now I don't know what you guys have cooking ATM, but things like this just have to be taken care of at some point, no? But then I'm sure y'all at chez ED know this too... The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 As a side note, I like to point out that I feel like a real crappy opening act for someone like the Stones... with that post following mine lol. 1 Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supersheep Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 EDGE is a part of 2.0.0 Cheers. Can't rep you up, so have a +1 for masterly deconflicting a rigged post. The PVC Pipe Joystick Stand How to thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 Nah, forget the personality cult thing there Sith, your response was fine IMHO. The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlidfan Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 As a side note, I like to point out that I feel like a real crappy opening act for someone like the Stones... with that post following mine lol. No opening act when I saw them last year, but don't worry, the roadies are important too! :) ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero, i7-6700K, Noctua NH-D14 Cooler, Crucial 32GB DDR4 2133, Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 256GB, Samsung EVO 250GB & 500GB SSD, 2TB Caviar Black, Zotac GTX 1080 AMP! Extreme 8GB, Corsair HX1000i, Phillips BDM4065UC 40" 4k monitor, VX2258 TouchScreen, TIR 5 w/ProClip, TM Warthog, VKB Gladiator Pro, Saitek X56, et. al., MFG Crosswind Pedals #1199, VolairSim Pit, Rift CV1 :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 No opening act when I saw them last year, but don't worry, the roadies are important too! :) I do do a lot of heavy lifting around here... Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 Nah, the fact is still that this is the only sim so far having this much promise, because pretty much everything preceding this has either been arcadish, incomplete or "balanced". But how long can you hold people's attention? Now I know I'm in this for the long run myself, because frankly speaking, what this sim does well it really does SO well that no-one can say anything about it, unless they either come up with something better themselves or show a competitor whose offerings are more realistic. But is that enough? What this environment is f.ex. missing badly is some kind of dynamism, because what really keeps folks attached to a sim is a possibility of being able to play, say, a campaign (or an online war) where the outcome is totally dependent on what goals are achieved. Now it's entirely possible to do pseudo-random missions even now - and I've done a bunch myself so I know - but that's not the same thing... So what I'm actually concerned about here - well apart from my personal pet peeves which I can live with, truth be telt - is that will this thing ever get finished to a point where you REALLY can say that this is the complete, unabridged, total and 100% bees knees? PS. Sorry for the rant, gotta rant sometimes. LOL The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 Honestly, from my point of view this is more of a sandbox development... but not quite, what I mean is it will never be *done*, but always evolving.... That said, I think there are some bugs out there that are hung up on the current sim architecture... so when you see things like dropping 32bit support, and moving to DirectX 11... things will begin to take shape a little better... again, this is only my opinion... like I said over in SimHQ one time... this is like house renovations, be we were to cheap to stay in a hotel, so we decided to suck it up and to put up with the construction. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 (edited) but always evolving Yah, but you still gotta nail something down at some point and call it done. Because if you don't peeps will just think you'll never get it finished... EDIT put up with the construction Yah, nothing wrong with that either, shows the punters that stuff's getting done too. But I still think my point stands... Edited July 18, 2014 by msalama The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 Yah, but you still gotta nail something down at some point and call it done. Because if you don't peeps will just think you'll never get it finished... Oh sure... its a happy medium right... and as I said, we are in the middle of house renovations.. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 EDIT Yah, nothing wrong with that either, shows the punters that stuff's getting done too. But I still think my point stands... It sure does, but consider this, you have the ever evolving DCS World, then you plop a product into it and move on to the next... you could call that product finished... but you are only lying to yourself, because everything affects everything... as in that product was finished, but now you added something to the core... it effects the finished product, now you have to balance, new products, ever changing core and of course existing products... in the business world, chances are the existing stuff gets a bit of a raw deal... Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 we are in the middle of house renovations.. Yah, wait for EDGE 1st and then see where we stand. Just wish it came out soonish ;) The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 Yah, wait for EDGE 1st and then see where we stand. Just wish it came out soonish ;) SO do I, I want to talk about it more :) The big thing for me will be the new map... Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobek Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Yah, but you still gotta nail something down at some point and call it done. Because if you don't peeps will just think you'll never get it finished... There's a difference between the features of modules and the features of the whole engine. Unfortunately even if a module is neatly wrapped up, it's almost a given that at some point the development on the evolving engine will break something in that module, no matter how careful you are. Good, fast, cheap. Choose any two. Come let's eat grandpa! Use punctuation, save lives! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 So yah, a bit of a dilemma then? Gotta adjust the core to make it better... but as a result possibly break something as you go, too, but still as an aim at the same time also introduce new functionality that the modules can take advantage of. But where does all that stop, or does it? The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobek Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 So yah, a bit of a dilemma then? That's a nice understatement. :) But where does all that stop, or does it? I certainly hope it doesn't. I hope the community keeps growing. More money for ED means they have more money to burn on keeping the software quality high. Good, fast, cheap. Choose any two. Come let's eat grandpa! Use punctuation, save lives! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kazereal Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 1- AI can always be improved, please feel free to list specific items in the AI problems sub forum. Until it becomes sentient and takes over.. the World! Mwahahahaa! *ahem* Did I just say that out loud? Seriously though, AI can be made believable but still rather dumb and predictable by just throwing more scripts at it for different conditions, but that ends up causing huge performance problems the more units there are. The things that seem ok for a single AI unit alone seem really dumb when there are plenty of units all doing the same thing. So some kind of group-level AI or faction-level AI would be more useful than improving just single unit AI? Also having over-powering AI is no use either (if it would be possible even..) Anyway, interesting to see where development will lead to ;) "I would have written a shorter post, but I did not have the time." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted July 18, 2014 ED Team Share Posted July 18, 2014 I think this is one of the key things about optimizing the core with things like EDGE and such... making more room for other things... I mean we are getting skeletal animations, they need to take advantage of that and give them some better brains... or some brains period :) Until it becomes sentient and takes over.. the World! Mwahahahaa! *ahem* Did I just say that out loud? Seriously though, AI can be made believable but still rather dumb and predictable by just throwing more scripts at it for different conditions, but that ends up causing huge performance problems the more units there are. The things that seem ok for a single AI unit alone seem really dumb when there are plenty of units all doing the same thing. So some kind of group-level AI or faction-level AI would be more useful than improving just single unit AI? Also having over-powering AI is no use either (if it would be possible even..) Anyway, interesting to see where development will lead to ;) Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts