Dust and Ice eng protec switch

yesterday flying a mission, my right engine sudenly turn off, after a eng vibrations message on the ekran.

That was the situation; flying low (6-10 mtr), pitots heat on, rotor anti-ice on, and eng protect in the upper position (ice/dust).

My question is, becouse the manual is not too clear: the eng protect switch is tree positions, the middle is off, down position is dust protection, and upper position is ice/dust protection, or only ice protection?

Thanks !

I'm pretty sure the upper position is only ice protection. There's also a rotor blade defroster too; you may want to use that in mountainous areas.

Upper is Anti Ice and Dust protection. It simply will provide some Hot Air from the Engines Bypass to the intakes and protect of Icing.

This also causes the powerlag.

As Capt Zeen has written the Rotor Anti ice has already been switched on.

But you should also never forget to turn on the *INU Heat* on the Backpanel.

Edit: Maybe th engines Proplem was caused by a Birdstrike or random Malfunktion.

ISE

Upper is Anti Ice and Dust protection. It simply will provide some Hot Air from the Engines Bypass to the intakes and protect of Icing.

This also causes the powerlag.

As Capt Zeen has written the Rotor Anti ice has already been switched on.

But you should also never forget to turn on the *INU Heat* on the Backpanel.

 

Edit: Maybe th engines Proplem was caused by a Birdstrike or random Malfunktion.

 

 

ISE

Thanks for the answers, anyway, the flight was a 5 ka-50 mission, and two of us got the same problem width just some seconds between one and the other. Thas was weird, unless we are not protected from dust. as i tell before we flyght low.

I thought I read in the manual that INU heat is not modeled in the sim.

if you are flying high altitude and your ice protection is on, and keep the engines on high RPM (yellow lights saying high RPM on the over head panel are lit up) for too long it will cause your engines to die in mid flight.

the same will happen if you have it on high rpm without ice protection, just not as soon.

if you are flying high altitude and your ice protection is on, and keep the engines on high RPM (yellow lights saying high RPM on the over head panel are lit up) for too long it will cause your engines to die in mid flight.

 

the same will happen if you have it on high rpm without ice protection, just not as soon.

I thought those yellow LEDs meant that the engines electronic protections (EEG) were currently active and automatically *limiting* RPM.

Which makes me wonder, Capt Zeen, if you haven't forgotten the EEGs for your flight? (in the case this was not a scripted event).

I thought those yellow LEDs meant that the engines electronic protections (EEG) were currently active and automatically *limiting* RPM.

 

Which makes me wonder, Capt Zeen, if you haven't forgotten the EEGs for your flight? (in the case this was not a scripted event).

EEG on

That is what those lights mean. The EEG's do keep the engines from overspeeding, but they also keep the engine from cooking itself (high EGT). So yes, it is limiting RPM by limiting fuel flow, but the reason is to keep from overtemping the engines. That's why if you try to pull in more collective with those lights illuminated while watching the rotor RPM's, you'll see the needle drop and you'll get the low RPM warning.

 

An experiment you can try to see how much engine power is being taken to run the anti-ice, is turn on the engine anti-ice and gradually pull in more power until you have barely enough to light up those caution lights. And then while watching the engine turbine temps, switch it off and see how much they drop.

 

This only works of course in level or at least a constant flight path. If you're maneuvering, even if the collective is staying constant, the engines will be spooling up and down to maintain a constant rotor RPM.

Thanks, that was very instructive :thumbup:

I shall definitely do that experience.

Will this also cause my engine to cutoff while in a hover ?

This also happened to me, I was just getting out of a hover and my right engine suddenly cut out. Unfortunately I don't have a track of this.

But I wasn't high up, maybe 600m and none of my de-icing switches were turned on.

I was able to pull an emergency landing and re-start my right engine, but it was weird how it just cut out like that.

Checking the labels on the switch on the russian version it seem the upper position says only ice (ПОС) (not ice/dust like in english) and the lower position says dust (ПЗУ)

Some russian can confirm this?

Checking the labels on the switch on the russian version it seem the upper position says only ice (ПОС) (not ice/dust like in english) and the lower position says dust (ПЗУ)

Some russian can confirm this?

They are abbreviations.

There are a couple of errors with the English cockpit. Note that the English cockpit was not created by nor is it maintained by ED.

POS is the ice protection system

PZU is the dust protection system

I guess they don't want you to be able to turn on both at the same time. On the Mi-8, the controls are separate, so you can have both on at the same time if you wanted to.

Anyway, the BS manual should clear it up:

Set the “ПОС ДВИГ – ОТКЛ – ПЗУ” (engines anti-icing/dust protection systems) switch to the “ПОС ДВИГ” (engines anti-icing) position, on the overhead panel “ПОС ЛЕВ ДВИГ” (anti-ice left engine) and the “ПОС ПРАВ ДВИГ” (anti-ice right engine) lights should illuminate.

Set the “ПОС ДВИГ – ОТКЛ – ПЗУ” (engines anti-icing/dust protection systems) switch to the “ПЗУ” (engine dust protectors) position. The “ПЗУ ЛЕВ ДВИГ” (left engine dust protector) and “ПЗУ ПРАВ ДВИГ” (right engine dust protector) lights should illuminate.

There are a couple of errors with the English cockpit. Note that the English cockpit was not created by nor is it maintained by ED.

 

POS is the ice protection system

PZU is the dust protection system

 

I guess they don't want you to be able to turn on both at the same time. On the Mi-8, the controls are separate, so you can have both on at the same time if you wanted to.

 

Anyway, the BS manual should clear it up:

 

Set the “ПОС ДВИГ – ОТКЛ – ПЗУ” (engines anti-icing/dust protection systems) switch to the “ПОС ДВИГ” (engines anti-icing) position, on the overhead panel “ПОС ЛЕВ ДВИГ” (anti-ice left engine) and the “ПОС ПРАВ ДВИГ” (anti-ice right engine) lights should illuminate.

 

Set the “ПОС ДВИГ – ОТКЛ – ПЗУ” (engines anti-icing/dust protection systems) switch to the “ПЗУ” (engine dust protectors) position. The “ПЗУ ЛЕВ ДВИГ” (left engine dust protector) and “ПЗУ ПРАВ ДВИГ” (right engine dust protector) lights should illuminate.

Thanks a lot!

Thats make sense

Anyone know for sure either way? Just curious.

+1

AlphaOneSix?

I wonder how those dust systems work.

(system on the MI-8 MTV2, pretty sure the one of the KA-50 is similar though)

The air inlet particle separator system protects the engine inlet during taxiing, takeoff,

and landing at unimproved airstrips and in sand/dust areas.

In addition the system provides electrical and bleed air anti-ice heating.

The system mounts on the front of the engine, in place of the nose cone assembly.

Each engine has an independent particle separator system. The system begins to operate

when bleed air is supplied to the ejector by opening the flow control valve.

The valve is controlled by the DUST PROT LEFT and DUST PROT RIGHT switches located on the

Pilot-Navigator's Right Side Console. When the system is running,

suction pulls contaminated air into the inlet duct passages (1).

Centrifugal forces throw the dust particles toward the aft dome surface (2)

where they are driven by the air flow through the separator baffles (4).

The main portion of the air, with the dust removed, passes through the duct to the engine air inlet (3).

The contaminated air (dust concentrate) is pulled into the dust ejector duct (5) and discharged overboard (6).

taken from;

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/products/magnificent_eight/?PAGEN_2=4

happy reading :book:

Thanks Falcon. I didn't think the Mi-8 page has a description as Ka-50 didn't have either.

What if the system is off? Does the sand pile up into the ejector tube and into the baffles while some of it is passed through the baffles into the intake?

What if the system is off? Does the sand pile up into the ejector tube and into the baffles while some of it is passed through the baffles into the intake?

Good question, it probably does if there is enough dust/sand in the air for that.

Then again, that's likely also the reason why the system should be on during take-off/landing and ground or low level ops.

Ones at cruise altitude you would in most places be in clean air and able to switch it off.