Static Object Problems, v124.12913

v124.12913

From observing two missions in a row, it seems that Static Objects at an airbase or FARP cannot be seen by an invading force, and therefore are not being destroyed.

The Static Objects that are left at the airbase or FARP after an invasion are preventing a Coalition Has Airdrome and Coalition Has Helipad event from triggering. Because these events do not trigger, missions cannot come to a conclusion - they just run on and on with nothing left to do.

The Static Objects that are causing this are the FARP Ammo, CP, Fuel and Tent.

I thought that if a superior armed force invades an airbase or FARP that still contained unarmed units, the superior force would determine that the airbase or FARP would flip ownership to the other side.

From an older A-10C GUI Manual -

COALITION HAS AIRDROME. If the set coalition has captured set airfield, the action(s) will be activated.

All airfields with no aircraft assigned for take-off or landing and with no ground units of either coalition within a 2,000 m. radius are neutral. Any ground unit present within a 2,000 m. radius of an airfield will capture the airfield for the coalition of the ground unit. If ground units of both coalitions are present with a 2,000 m. radius of an airfield, the airfield is contested and not assigned to either coalition. In cases when armed ground units of one coalition are present within a 2,000 m. radius of an airfield at the same time as unarmed ground units of the other coalition, the coalition of the armed units will capture the airfield.

Problems:

Static Objects cannot be seen by the opposite coalition.

Static Objects at an airbase or FARP prevent a Coalition Has Airdrome or Coalition Has Helipad event from triggering, when a superior force from the opposite coalition is present.

I started a test mission this morning to prove my suspicions but had to go to work - I will finish that up later today and post it.

WC

Here's the test mission.

To reproduce what I saw in other regular missions I had to set Fog Of War.

I'm having no joy trying to destroy the FARP CP with the Red armor - weird...

I watch the action in the F12 View and that shows the FARP stays Blue with a US flag in the lower left. But the flares switch over to Red - curiouser and curiouser..

I have to go back to work. :-(

WC

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I am working on this -- had a message problem in v1b. -- WC

I have a newer mission with events to show the progress. I've been testing in ME Single Player and want to test it under server/Client conditions.

I should be able to get this finished w/in 24 hours. I will post my findings.

WC

It appears that static object of buildings will have no effect on whether or not an airbase or farp can be captured. However static objects of normal ground combat units will prevent a capture. Ground AI will also ignore these objects as they ignore combat with all static objects.

It also seems that only static objects of ground vehicles and ships are revealed by FOW, and are only revealed by an aircraft. I have reported that bug.

Thanks, Grimes.

I'm running multiplayer testing with the first two regular missions that have issues, and will put the test mission onto the multiplayer server tonight. I need to see if MP does different things from SP.

I am not using 'normal' units as Static Objects - only the four FARP structures, and the FARP object.

What I do see consistently with the test mission in SP is that after Red captures the Blue FARP, the F12 View of the FARP continues to show the US Flag in the lower left corner of the screen instead of switching over to the Russian Flag. And the Red armor was unable to destroy the Blue FARP CP no matter what weapon I used with T-90s and BMPs; on another test run the Red armor could not destroy the Ammo (or was it the Fuel - it has a soldier standing next to it).

WC

The country an object belongs to never changes, but you should notice that the FARP will appear on the F10 map once it is captured, and it will be a different color to denote which side controls it.

I had also used FARP static objects in my test and the FARP was captured just fine. I'll have to check the static objects damage, but most buildings have a lot higher HP than most would expect.

Grimes,

"The country an object belongs to never changes.."

I have missions where an airbase will start out as Red or Blue and be captured by the opposite side. One of the ways I use to see which side has the airbase is to use the F11 View. My recollection is that the lower left of the view will show an appropriate flag for the coalition that 'owns' the airbase. And if the airbase is Neutral then the flag in the lower left is grey.

^^^ Based on the way the F11 View shows the airbase 'flag', should I expect the F12 View to show the FARP's flag in the same way? Should the FARP's flag in F12 View change from the Blue side's flag to the Red side's flag in F12 when Red captures it? Are you saying that because the FARP is a placed object that its F12 View flag will not change after the other side captures it?

---

"you should notice that the FARP will appear on the F10 map once it is captured, and it will be a different color to denote which side controls it."

^^^ I am seeing this in my test mission in SP. Red cannot see the Blue FARP in F10 View, and cannot see the Blue FARP Structures. But when Red captures the FARP in SP then the FARP shows in Red F10 and it is indeed red in color.

More testing again tonight...

WC

PS - It is interesting that the opposite coalition cannot see a FARP in F10 FOW. I have missions where a FARP is a mission objective.

Please, Grimes, tell us if the effective zone for a FARP is also 2,000 meters like it is for an airbase? In other words, for a Coalition Has Airdrome the coalition must own the area within 2,000m of the base - is that 2,000m value also true for the Coalition Has Helipad?

--- edit --- still looking hard at this, made progress but could not finish it tonight, 5-Jun-2013

Airbases are not a placed object like FARPS are, thus airbases have slightly different rules that apply to em. Farps are owned by a country which belongs to a coalition, where as airbases simply belong to the coalition.

I'm not sure what the capture distance is, my best guess is 1 to 2 km though.

v124.12913

Grimes -

Thanks for helping me out with my issues. The in-mission problem was one proximity of FARPs.

I'll tell you all - for all the testing I did - see the attachment for the main test mission - the ground unit AI is impressive! I love watching the anti-armor missiles streak across the battlefield. Every play of a mission results in different AI behavior.

The reason my new mission did not see the capture of the FARP was because another FARP was on its 2Km boundary.

This investigation has clarified a number of things for me.

- In F10 FOW:

-- The opposite coalition's Static Objects cannot be seen

-- Captured Static Object FARPs can be seen in F10 in the capturing side's color

-- Other Static Objects can't be captured or seen in F10

--- But in F10 unrestricted view (undefined vs FOW), all Static Objects can be seen with their Blue/Red/White (Neutral) colors.

(Mission Designers need to set up the View settings early in development.)

- FARP capture zone is approximately 2,000 meters (same as for airbases). (Nautical Miles UK vs US? (<-minor) ) Two FARPS near each other makes this boundary kinda fuzzy. Best to get several hundred yards/meters separation beyond that 2Km capture zone when placing FARPs near each other.

- F12 View Static Objects - As Grimes said - a F12 View of a Static Object FARP will always show the original 'owner' of the FARP by virtue of the Flag in the lower left of the screen. The Flag in F12 does not change to the other side after the FARP is captured. This threw me for a bit...

- Static Objects near a FARP do not prevent a FARP from being captured.

FYI - Immortal Units

- A Unit designated as Immortal remains alive after an event that Explodes On Unit.

- An Immortal Unit must be Deactivated to be 'Dead'.

-- I don't have Immortal units in my missions, but tested them here.

Geeez - this really had me going - went down a few paths to try to duplicate the issues in test missions, but never could. I had to 'learn' what worked in the test missions and kept adjusting the MP mission until that worked.

Wrecking Crew

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