Transition from FWD flight to hover?

Okay, I've been flying the Gazelle for a short time but the one area I seem to keep running into trouble is how to transition from forward flight into auto-hover. Sometimes I get it right but most times I screw it up. Any hints/advice from the learned masses?

Okay, I've been flying the Gazelle for a short time but the one area I seem to keep running into trouble is how to transition from forward flight into auto-hover. Sometimes I get it right but most times I screw it up. Any hints/advice from the learned masses?

Use the Nadir always, use it to know your true airspeed (Remember that you can`t enable auto-hover if you are more than 20km/h or 1/-1 m/s)

The trick that worked for me was the muscle memory, I mean, when you are going slower, you will notice that you are going to need more rudder. It is just a matter of time and when you will notice, you will be doing this automatically.

You must look at Speed and Vertical Speed, use a point in the ground, it helps

For exiting auto-hover? just match the settings applied by the autopilot.

Also, dont panic if you need to add a lot of power, sometimes you must push this thing but don`t do it too often or it will break!

If something goes wrong into the transition, push the nose foward and add a the maximun amount of power and try to level it as soon as you can

Thank you for the hints/tips. I'm okay exiting auto-hover, it's getting in to it that needs the work. Seems like when I pull the nose up to slow down I gain to much altitude, probably need some better coordination w/the collective at that time. Thanks again for the info.

Do the opposite : have your collective drive the slow down. By that I mean that you should first drop collective until you get a negative vertical speed, continue dropping it and keep the vertical null by nosing up until v speed returns to zero. You'll do this until you get really slow, at which point you must prepare for a sudden collective raise (and corresponding right pedal input) because she drops like a brick at a certain point.

Whisper has it right. In the Gazelle the collective is more like a throttle in a jet than a collective in a chopper until you're moving very slowly.

Transitioning from forward flight, lower the collective and compensate for the vertical speed with the cyclic until you start to hit the 80-60kph band, then you'll need to slowly add right pedal and collective to control your vertical speed while still raising the nose further to continue slowing down.

Do the opposite : have your collective drive the slow down. By that I mean that you should first drop collective until you get a negative vertical speed, continue dropping it and keep the vertical null by nosing up until v speed returns to zero. You'll do this until you get really slow, at which point you must prepare for a sudden collective raise (and corresponding right pedal input) because she drops like a brick at a certain point.

Whisper has it right. In the Gazelle the collective is more like a throttle in a jet than a collective in a chopper until you're moving very slowly.

 

Transitioning from forward flight, lower the collective and compensate for the vertical speed with the cyclic until you start to hit the 80-60kph band, then you'll need to slowly add right pedal and collective to control your vertical speed while still raising the nose further to continue slowing down.

Thank you both very much for the advice! Now to go put it to use!

Same as the kamov.

If you need to exit forward travel into a stationary attack position quickly then a hard turn, hard rudder into the turn around your fire zone is the best way... transition forward flight into sideways slip to avoid VRS. Indeed the sideways slip speed becomes king in this manoeuvre.

The technique here explained is excellent Len62. It's something you need to get used to. Learn the technique on higher altitude without even going into auto hover. (try to manually hover the best you can) Once you feel comfortable in doing that, also use the gages (ADI,Vertical Speed Indicator) and the Nadir set to current speed. Know the requirements.

Thanks for the input Rogue Trooper and AVI-8. I've gotten a little better but will practice some more using these suggestions. I'm getting better at coordinating the collective and cyclic inputs, while monitoring the gauges.

Thanks for the input Rogue Trooper and AVI-8. I've gotten a little better but will practice some more using these suggestions. I'm getting better at coordinating the collective and cyclic inputs, while monitoring the gauges.

yeah she is a little devil when it comes to understanding the choppers position in the virtual world, everything changes quickly.

I would say that after 30 odd hours of flight I am starting to get comfortable with the low sitting view out of the chopper and the cockpit layout so that I can start to glance at dials whilst believing what I see out the window.

lovely little challenge this Gazelle.:D

Before you take off for the first time, you should cycle to ALT > SPEED > center on the autopilot hold switch (not 100% sure of the exact nomenclature at this time). This initializes the velocities in the inertial system. The Gazelle is a LOT easier to fly after you do this. You're basically flying without the SAS if you don't.

why cycle from alt hold through center position before takeoff?

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Thank you for the hints/tips. I'm okay exiting auto-hover, it's getting in to it that needs the work. Seems like when I pull the nose up to slow down I gain to much altitude, probably need some better coordination w/the collective at that time. Thanks again for the info.

Think of the transition to hover occurring in two stages:

Stage 1: Simultaneous and gradual reduction in collective with a little bit of backward pressure on your cyclic. Your aim is to bleed off your airspeed while keeping that VSI needle pointing zero. So keep referring to your VSI. You won't be pulling back much on the cyclic initially (when IAS>120km/hr), so don't be afraid to slowly reduce collective from 80% to say 50% torque (depending on how fast you want to transition), your cyclic will easily make up for the loss in lift with just very small backward pressure to maintain altitude. So don't think of the cyclic as the means to kill off airspeed and hence the need to pitch up aggressively, think of the collective as being responsible for that and the cyclic for maintaining altitude (although in theory it's the opposite yes). So remember, cyclic to keep your VSI needle pointing zero, whether that means pulling back more or less all depends on how much and how fast you drop your collective, but naturally as you lose speed you will begin to pull back more and more on the cyclic in order to maintain altitude. As you approach 40km you can start anticipating the need to apply right anti-torque pedal, when that happens you're in Stage 2.

Stage 2: Gradual increase in collective while slightly reducing your pitch angle. Anticipate that you would probably need bring your torque back in the range of 70%-80% at some point, so work towards that gradually. At IAS<20km/hr, you're now keeping that VSI needle centred not with the cyclic but more with the collective. In other words, at this stage, it's the reverse; the cyclic will bleed off what is left from your forward speed and the collective will keep you from losing altitude, and the anti-torque pedal to maintain heading.

Thinking in this way has helped me with my transitions to hover. With practice you can build that into your muscle memory and you would know how much movement in cyclic and collective you need to make, and you will be able to do that fast. But yes you don't need to pull back on the cyclic as much as in a Ka-50 for example :thumbup:

Think of the transition to hover occurring in two stages:

 

Stage 1: Simultaneous and gradual reduction in collective with a little bit of backward pressure on your cyclic. Your aim is to bleed off your airspeed while keeping that VSI needle pointing zero. So keep referring to your VSI. You won't be pulling back much on the cyclic initially (when IAS>120km/hr), so don't be afraid to slowly reduce collective from 80% to say 50% torque (depending on how fast you want to transition), your cyclic will easily make up for the loss in lift with just very small backward pressure to maintain altitude. So don't think of the cyclic as the means to kill off airspeed and hence the need to pitch up aggressively, think of the collective as being responsible for that and the cyclic for maintaining altitude (although in theory it's the opposite yes). So remember, cyclic to keep your VSI needle pointing zero, whether that means pulling back more or less all depends on how much and how fast you drop your collective, but naturally as you lose speed you will begin to pull back more and more on the cyclic in order to maintain altitude. As you approach 40km you can start anticipating the need to apply right anti-torque pedal, when that happens you're in Stage 2.

 

Stage 2: Gradual increase in collective while slightly reducing your pitch angle. Anticipate that you would probably need bring your torque back in the range of 70%-80% at some point, so work towards that gradually. At IAS<20km/hr, you're now keeping that VSI needle centred not with the cyclic but more with the collective. In other words, at this stage, it's the reverse; the cyclic will bleed off what is left from your forward speed and the collective will keep you from losing altitude, and the anti-torque pedal to maintain heading.

 

Thinking in this way has helped me with my transitions to hover. With practice you can build that into your muscle memory and you would know how much movement in cyclic and collective you need to make, and you will be able to do that fast. But yes you don't need to pull back on the cyclic as much as in a Ka-50 for example :thumbup:

A perfect explanation. :thumbup:

Hope this helps in addition to my explanation above :)

Perfect!

And with practice the slowdowns to hover become faster and indeed an integral part of the landing.

Eventually.. stopping to hover becomes truly violent with minimum problems.

Perfect!

And with practice the slowdowns to hover become faster and indeed an integral part of the landing.

Eventually.. stopping to hover becomes truly violent with minimum problems.

Yup nothing like an aggressive 40 degrees pitch up to slow down and quickly mask behind a building! :D Those are the Gazelle's best moments!

Indeed, but not tried to decelerate against the building like I do in the Kamov!:devil:

Just in case my last statement is miss understood... I believe that increasing thrust across the flat vertical surface of a building does indeed produce lift. I did done do it so many times that I believe it to be so.

The windows giving under such pressure would indeed be sublime.

Indeed, but not tried to decelerate against the building like I do in the Kamov!

I for one would love to see a video of this!:thumbup:

Please?

I'm probably doing it wrong, but a hundred or so hours in the Mi-8 gave me pretty good feel for predicting helicoptor reactions. I manage to go from movement into a hover fairly quickly at lower altitudes just using visual reference and the dial that tells me how much height I'm losing or gaining. I slow, and increase collective when I know my power won't be enough to keep me in the air.

At higher altitudes, I have to rely completely on dials as you can't see how much you are moving around. This takes me a while to get into a hover, but I very rarely need to do this.

Prediction is key.