Panthro Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I'd love to toy with this a bit myself, bu I dont see how it could be made accurate without big $$$ :( how did the acrylic sheet work out for proof of concept? [sIGPIC]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic86362_2.gif[/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepara Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) PeterP I used my slow laptop just to try your measurements and I got the same slight shift. the only time its accurate is when i close one eye. when both eyes concentrate on the hud it looks like this : the distance from the HUD to the projector is all that matters. it makes our eyes converge on different points each time. pilots never face this problem in real life cause they never face targets 1.5 meter from the HUD display. my current distance from hud to projection is 1.5 m and from eyes to projection is about 2.5 m. what do think? p.s the physical HUD is the same size as in game (around 95% to be precise )...PeterP dont get me wrong you advise is absolutely correct but only to make the HUD same size as in game HUD. but still you cannot avoid the convergence and thats where the problem. Now everybody I just want to make clear that this setup is absolutely playable and precise. I just strive to perfection Edited July 9, 2012 by sleepara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepara Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I'd love to toy with this a bit myself, bu I dont see how it could be made accurate without big $$$ :( how did the acrylic sheet work out for proof of concept? I want to calm you down mate. the HUD was the cheapest in my build. 2 x reflective glass = 15$ 1 x 19'' lg lcd monitor from recycle shop = 50$ what do you say about that? thats right ...not a big deal :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flim Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I use special glass and it cost more money, but it is 40% see through mirror with zero double image effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepara Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 what double image effect do you mean? like described above? how distant is your hud from game screen/projection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) Originally Posted by Panthro I'd love to toy with this a bit myself, bu I dont see how it could be made accurate without big $$$ As Sleepara said: material cost are not a problem at all - you just have to work very precise.. . Originally Posted by Panthro how did the acrylic sheet work out for proof of concept? Nothing really spectacular - just exactly what you expect when holding a acrylic sheet in a 45° angle at you monitor and observe the reflection. Try it out your self! :) This tests just gave me the confidence that it sure will work and is bright enough for a HUD assembly. PeterP I used my slow laptop just to try your measurements and I got the same slight shift. the only time its accurate is when i close one eye. when both eyes concentrate on the hud it looks like this : what do think? I think its time to build a "real " proof of concept for me and invite one of the workers of the optician-shop at the other side of my road - for a beer after work / seeing a desktop-simulator running - and have a look at this HUD-problem I have at home!:) Maybe he will have a idea with which kind of lens it can be compensated. But this will take probably about a month for me... Next weekend I have a brunch at Saturday and I will visit the ZOO at Sunday... And the weekend after I will go bicycling/camping two days with some friends - so not much "practical" time for building something up for testing left the next three weeks for me. ...PeterP dont get me wrong you advise is absolutely correct but only to make the HUD same size as in game HUD. but still you cannot avoid the convergence and thats where the problem. Now everybody I just want to make clear that this setup is absolutely playable and precise. I just strive to perfection No problem at all :)!!! Just like I wrote some postings before: All that I know about this relies on my knowledge about physics and my common sense...- there is always the possibility that I miss something! But I'm very sure that we all together will sort this "wrong convergence" out in the near future !:) I have already the slight guess that positioning a Fresnel-lens between the mirrors and moving it - just to see what happens - will bring some enlightenment. Edited July 9, 2012 by PeterP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metalnwood Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I know a guy, he designed the corrector lens for one of my scopes and could probably help out a bit. I have shied away from thinking about this kind of thing because of the quality and potential problems with lining it up. If you guys think you pretty much have it nailed and the optical glass is the only issue then I dont mind playing around with it either. Although that will take me up to 6 screens! I need my 7970 to be replaced with a 9990. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panthro Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I am so going to do this I just thought to align it well would take some expensive stuff you could try using alloy reflective plate to remove double imaging from the lower mirror. @sleepara you would think if the screen and your hud had the same focal point you wouldnt get the stereoscopic praralaxing errors :( [sIGPIC]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic86362_2.gif[/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metalnwood Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 I am so going to do this I just thought to align it well would take some expensive stuff you could try using alloy reflective plate to remove double imaging from the lower mirror. @sleepara you would think if the screen and your hud had the same focal point you wouldnt get the stereoscopic praralaxing errors :( You mean an alumiminzed plate rahter than an aliminium plate? Something acrylic with the mirrored finish should be cheap and has the morror on the first surface. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadman Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 May i suggest a first surfaced mirror in front of the LCD and a piece of Dichroic glass as the HUD glass http://viperpits.org/smf/index.php?topic=5057.0 http://www.thorlabs.us/search/thorsearch.cfm?search=Subtractive+Dichroic+Color http://www.firstsurfacemirror.com/ A cheep way to make your own first surface mirror 1 https://www.shapeways.com/shops/a-10c-warthog-supplies https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepara Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 wow thats cool!... @METALNWOOD I used the same semi transparent reflective glass for the bottom "mirroring". the only difference is that i had a vinyl black decal applied on the back non reflective side. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panthro Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) @deadman now thats a nice find. have filed those away!! @Metalnwood cheers thanks for translating thats what I meant! Edited July 10, 2012 by Panthro [sIGPIC]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic86362_2.gif[/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinja Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) edit: Arrggh, sniped by Deadman! Nice... Sorry to butt in, rep all round btw! I'm lurking massively here, just not active 'cos I'm in between pits and have no machine at the moment. Random aside: 1) What are the dimensions of a real-life A-10 HUD? 2) Flim/sleepara, what glass exactly did you use? I had thought of using as thin acrylic as I can find with this overlaid: http://www.purlsol.com/products_bymeter_list.php?catid=92 Stupid idea? overkill? Edited July 10, 2012 by Jinja i7@3.5Ghz, ATI 5870, 16GB RAM, win7 64bit, TH2GO, Track-IR, 4screen pit, TM WArthog HOTAS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted July 10, 2012 Author Share Posted July 10, 2012 (edited) 1)That is what I have. And I didn't found anything at the www. Would be nice if someone could cross-check if this measurements are legit ... I have contacted someone that will have access to a A-10C in September. He will pass us the the dimension from a HUD that is actual in service . Edit: Thanks Deadman! Made some re-calculations relating on known measurements like the UFC and took also the width of Deadmans measurements into it. So I did come up with this dimensions for the HUD in the A-10C. Deadmans measurements on a old HUD: 2) ... about the glass...I got it from the local "Glazier"...that's how u call a guy that custom builds windows?...just look for a reflective window or semi reflective window at the local shop. it must have one reflective side which reflects from the surface itself in contrary of a mirror which makes the reflection travel through the entire mirror thickness (for example 2mm thick or 5mm thick mirror ) Edited July 11, 2012 by PeterP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadman Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 I don't have access to a new HUD but I do have an older one i can check it tonight it must have the same basic measurements. https://www.shapeways.com/shops/a-10c-warthog-supplies https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepara Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 edit: Arrggh, sniped by Deadman! Nice... Sorry to butt in, rep all round btw! I'm lurking massively here, just not active 'cos I'm in between pits and have no machine at the moment. Random aside: 1) What are the dimensions of a real-life A-10 HUD? 2) Flim/sleepara, what glass exactly did you use? I had thought of using as thin acrylic as I can find with this overlaid: http://www.purlsol.com/products_bymeter_list.php?catid=92 Stupid idea? overkill? I guess it can work but I would'nt travel too far mate...just grab a piece of reflective-glass and call it a day. 100% working concept and cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panthro Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 I don't have access to a new HUD but I do have an older one i can check it tonight it must have the same basic measurements. could you measure the whole hud unit please not just the hud glass ??:clap: much karma to ya regardless:thumbup: [sIGPIC]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic86362_2.gif[/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadman Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 Here is what i had time to measure I have knobs to mold and cast 1 https://www.shapeways.com/shops/a-10c-warthog-supplies https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y2kiah Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 much appreciated I "must spread some reputation before giving it to Deadman again" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadman Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 If I had the time I would take pictures of all the parts I have so you guys could get a look,but it is hard enough to get time to work on the knobs, let a lone the pit plans right now https://www.shapeways.com/shops/a-10c-warthog-supplies https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cali Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 What do you have going on dm, what's keeping you so busy? i7-4820k @ 3.7, Windows 7 64-bit, 16GB 1866mhz EVGA GTX 970 2GB, 256GB SSD, 500GB WD, TM Warthog, TM Cougar MFD's, Saitek Combat Pedals, TrackIR 5, G15 keyboard, 55" 4K LED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 (edited) Thanks Deadman! Made some re-calculations relating on known measurements like the UFC and took also the width of Deadmans measurements into it. So I did come up with this dimensions for the HUD in the A-10C. Edited July 11, 2012 by PeterP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadman Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 Wife,Two jobs summer hunny do list, a bit of flying, family outing with my relatives, basically live and only a 24 day:lol: What do you have going on dm, what's keeping you so busy? https://www.shapeways.com/shops/a-10c-warthog-supplies https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Powell Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 Wife,Two jobs summer hunny do list, a bit of flying, family outing with my relatives, basically live and only a 24 day:lol: It gets worse when you retire. The "free" time gained is more than offset by retirement honey-do lists made by wives who have had years to develop skills at making lists which sound quite reasonable and are somehow impossible to argue your way out of. Mike Powell www.mikesflightdeck.com www.mikesflightdeckbooks.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cali Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 Wife,Two jobs summer hunny do list, a bit of flying, family outing with my relatives, basically live and only a 24 day:lol: Two summer jobs? tell the hunny to do the list :D. 24 hours in a day kinda suck when you throw in sleep, which I hate. It gets worse when you retire. The "free" time gained is more than offset by retirement honey-do lists made by wives who have had years to develop skills at making lists which sound quite reasonable and are somehow impossible to argue your way out of. Don't say that! I have 7 years before I can retire. Gotta make sure all the bills are paid off by then! i7-4820k @ 3.7, Windows 7 64-bit, 16GB 1866mhz EVGA GTX 970 2GB, 256GB SSD, 500GB WD, TM Warthog, TM Cougar MFD's, Saitek Combat Pedals, TrackIR 5, G15 keyboard, 55" 4K LED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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