Question about HOT (1,2,3?) performance

The question also is, how "hard" is the rolled wire attached to the HOT, will the missile pull the wire off hard (wire will be nearly straight) or will the weight of cable be a stronger pulling force and the wire thus hanging, maybe even touching ground between Gazelle and target?

The wire is typically a steel wire covered with copper, but some use aluminium wire as well.

And at short distances the wire will be hanging in the air, but the spool in the missile is not controlling the wire but it is coming out just by the pull force. This is to lower the risk to snap wire once the wire gets tangled on the ground (and it will get tangled on the ground) and missile is moving.

And this makes it as well difficult as anything moving between missile and the platform can snap the wire.

HOT is SACLOS and doesn't require lock what so ever. The only parameters that is required for launch is to get the launch authorization. And then that you don't run out of that 4300m worth of wire in the missile.

The missile will fly where ever you point the crosshair, but its profile has been set so it will seek to impact point at launch parameters (ranged distance) as missile will be guided about 50cm above the line of sight all the way to the launch metered distance where it is lowered to crosshair.

Once the wire is cut (either because tangled to something or you run out of that 4300m length) missile goes dumb and doesn't receive anymore control commands and will fly as its trajectory and drag makes it to fly.

But I don't think that DCS simulates the wire by what so ever, as it would require simulating the trees and other obstacles so the wire can get tangled etc. We don't even have a working systems for obstacles like trees breaking the lock for targeting systems.

So launching platforms has easy simple way to engage ground targets. (we do have some level timer for tracking to be lost, but not really working one, as vehicles can pass easily trees or go to forests and systems can automatically track and even lock-on them when we don't see anything.)

So currently in DCS after 4300m the HOT will just drop down?

Nope, after that distance it'll keep flying like an unguided rocket until it burns out the fuel or impacts into something.

So currently in DCS after 4300m the HOT will just drop down?

Ok well that's what I meant.

Nope, after that distance it'll keep flying like an unguided rocket until it burns out the fuel or impacts into something.

Doesn't HOT have a safe mechanism for self-destruction if no more commands are given?

As it means either wire is cut or launcher is destroyed or killed.

And sure that moment the wanted could be to get missile fly the trajectory it was going (spinning) so it could kill possible target as "dead man will".

The real HOT3 I believe gets disarmed after the wire exceed the limit or communication is lost, but I'm sure could still probably hurt someone even without exploding.

The issue is more in ED code that once a missile or a rocket becomes alive, it has to blow up at some point. So were working in the environment we're given. Maybe someday in the future we'll be able to make weapons go inert after sometime.

Doesn't HOT have a safe mechanism for self-destruction if no more commands are given?

As it means either wire is cut or launcher is destroyed or killed.

And sure that moment the wanted could be to get missile fly the trajectory it was going (spinning) so it could kill possible target as "dead man will".

Yes, but still you don't really move. The HOT missile will fly about 50cm above the sighting system line of sight, and after the fire missile will pop-up for that range. So you don't need to move at all when you have that 20-30m distance to obstacles so missile gets above it. So your firing position is always behind the obstacle so Vivian only see over it. And you don't want to risk your commander to lose the line of sight to the missile as then guidance will go wacko. So even if you slightly lower too low that Vivian line of sight is blocked for couple seconds, missile is likely gone.

 

The wire is so thin that you easily snap it off. The problem is to launch missile at correct moment as even a moving target that passes trees or poles will easily get wire cut off as the wire is tangled to the missile route and then slight movement between the tangled wire part and launching platform can snap it.

 

The most important part is still that you change firing position after each launch and avoid become visible until just before the launch. And that your position to the obstacles front of you is so that there is enough space to missile pop-up above line of sight and you don't need to move at all.

 

The helicopter that can actually lower itself to cover after launch is Apache with AGM-114L as it doesn't require guidance after launch and helicopter can hide where wanted (or actually can fire from the cover once the helicopter has got the targets via radar.

Do you noticed that the german PAH's don't keep 20-30m between them and their cover? It's only a hairpin that would fit between the treeline and their rotordisc as you can see from 2:30 in the video. In this case you have to popup or your missile will go straight into the next tree.

Do you noticed that the german PAH's don't keep 20-30m between them and their cover? It's only a hairpin that would fit between the treeline and their rotordisc as you can see from 2:30 in the video. In this case you have to popup or your missile will go straight into the next tree.

Yes, but they didn't neither lower to cover after launch but staid in stable hover. It was only commenter who said they would do so.

And on video they had space between them and tree heights. It was two different videos showing the targeting through trees and launch.

And you wouldn't fly close for a few reasons.

1) you don't get better cover or concealment by flying few inches from trees than flying 50m from them.

2) flying so close risks you to touch them when windy (either you move or trees branches move) or caused to move by you.

3) you don't have safe space for maneuvers in case of emergency, ie. Someone catch you, like a recon team or so close by.

4) the trees close by disturb the air flow, making extremely risky to enter to vortex ring (very common mistake that helicopter pilots does when flying near buildings and trees)

5) disrupted airflow get leaves and others up in the air and you don't want them inside your turbines (even when you have filters etc)

6) flying close to the trees causes them to start waving by your rotor, revealing your position (movement reveals position multiple times further than staying still at open)

7) And a waving tree that has your wire = snapped wire because it doesn't matter does wire spool locate in missile, as the tangled wire is between helicopter and the trees next to you, pulling it by force generated by your rotor wash.

8) risking that LOS is lost in 15-17s (or what the flight time was to max range) for guidance isn't optional. And anyways, if you are 3-4km from a target at cold war era, you don't need such maneuvers to hide yourself so much. Like go out and look at 3-4km range and visualize a helicopter front profile hovering somewhere.... What reveals it really is sound for infantry and if there is diesel/gas turbine nearby, you don't hear helicopter.

Them comes about the video:

1) It is combination from multiple takes in different places and times.

2) it is a presentation for media, planned by officers and staged.

3) it is used clever camera tricks about angles and field of views to create immersion of something that isn't happening.

4) It has a assigned pilots (usually best ones) to boost the skills of the military capabilities.

So yes, you can lower quickly after launch but when you are already in observation position and you have launch parameters, you don't need to.

And those ATGM flights work together, you get multiple strikes at once from different directions and you just don't have a time to react. It is most effective to pop-up simultaneously and destroy armored platoon once than try to do it one at the time, as after first hit the process is to drive fast as possible to safest position. And the problem many forgets is that MBT doesn't move alone but has infantry support at flanks and behind/front of them.

And in Germany (like rest) armors don't go to the forest, but once you are attacked by ATGM, Artillery etc.... You drive there what is safest position (secured by you).

And today if you are against a modern MBT/IFV they will spot you with a thermal as your rotor will blow hot air all around you. And a trees that you want to conceal you, is not covering from a shells or arrows even when you are at 4km range. But at least we are not simulating >1990 times but 1950-198? era.

But DCS doesn't simulate AI spotting well, there is no concealment for ground units (they are most often wide open) and we still can fire and fly through trees in 1.5, and NTTR doesn't really have a trees... So the combat for both ends is very simple and allows/forces to actions that wouldn't be needed or possible.

So I guess firing over high voltage power lines is a no no. ;)

So I guess firing over high voltage power lines is a no no. ;)

Does DCS even simulate wire?

But there is a reason why birds and powerline repairers/washers can touch to those.