Two MS FFB2 with Cougar Grip

Thanks for the answers!

I will definately be using a counterweight after giving it some more thought.

What is the FFB testing program that you are using?

\Eagle Dynamics\DCS Black Shark 2\bin\FFTest.exe

Here is a useful tip how I calculated the needed counterweight:

Thanks for the info!

After taking the two MSFFB's apart and planning how I will join them, it almost seems like they were meant to be attached to each other! Very excited to start this project this weekend.

Unfortunately I will only have a little time over the next 3 days, and then I'm off to work for another 2 weeks.... so will likely have to finish then.

Achtung!!

From SimHQ: http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3506398/Re_Two_MS_FFB2_merged_into_one.html#Post3506398

I also found out when DirectX send a FFB command it will executed by every FFB controller you add.

I found it out by moving my MS-FFB2 and saw that the Logitech FBB-steering wheel turned also in the x-axis the same as the joystick...

Ok I stared some tests and I'm having trouble replicating the above behavior. Both joysticks seem to remain independent. This was observed in IL-2 1946 and FS FORCE a force feedback testing tool.

Any Idea what ight be wrong?

My answer:

Are both controllers recognized by IL-2? - I didn't tested it up to now. and I have no working installation at the moment at my system.

I after I got IL-2 CloD I thought I wouldn't need my IL-2 1946 installation any more... btw:in the meantime I also de-installed CloD ;).

 

In DCS both controllers are working in sync.

 

And - yes - In a FFB-Test program you can only Talk at one controller at a time.

 

But I wasn't worried about this since it does exactly what I want in DCS.

 

I was first thinking about connecting both motors at a single axis to the same wires wit a Y cable - but I feared that this could fry the board - so I didn't tried.

Maybe someone has more experience/knowledge with electronics if this is possible.

 

 

Very Cool, Nice Work, ever throught of setting up a production line? :thumbup: I bet you could sell them for a lot.

But alot of the fun is making you own pit modifications i guess.

Super!

Great work!

hmmm, i guess i will be re-buying the MSFFB2 and join the ebay hunt for a cougar...

How to test FF

Peter,

I have two MS FFB sticks disassembled and I am trying to test whether I have them wired correctly. In your video you show what appears to be a calibration program that allows you to vary the FFB input to the stick to move the stick. I am running W7 x64. I have looked in the calibration utility for W7 and can't figure out what you using. Can you help?

Froggie

posting #27:

\Eagle Dynamics\DCS Black Shark 2\bin\FFTest.exe

This program will only talk to one controller at a time.

so you will have to switch between both controllers to check if they work "mirrored" to each other.

It can be sometimes a little confusing...:) - so a paper and pencil will be your friend while doing it!

-When you make pictures of the cables of the potentiometers of the second (down) MSFFB2 - I can tell you how to rewire them. - so you will have no trial and error.

(I have still my notes...somewhere;))

PeterP,

Thanks:) As many times as I have reread this thread, I don't know how I missed that.

I have FFTest up and running. It sees the MS FFB stick. When I select the stick the sliders and buttons become active. However, when I move the sliders nothing happens. I haven't disconnected anything yet:)

When I grab the stick and push a button or pull the trigger I do get a FF shake like it is programmed for some FF action.

Not sure what I am doing wrong. I click "Start" under Constant Force Effect then move the sliders. Nothing:(

Check-list:

-both controllers are visible in the game controllers option of windows?

-both have power?

-both have the photo-cell covered?

-both are selectable in FFTest?

Btw: I was asked now two times via PM if I know if there is a problem with using a "Red" one and a "Grey" MSFFB2 - to be honest I never worried about this and I used myself a mix of this two different models.

The "Master" (up) is a "Red" and the upside-down is a "Grey" in my build!

PeterP,

Both have a green power light....both are selectable....where is the photo-cell? Not doubt this is the problem:) Why is there a photo-cell?

Both are grey. The one that works (maybe the photo-cell has so much dust on it that it is covered!) has a very strong FF. Wow! I can't imagine two in parallel!

Thanks for the help Peter!

Follow-up: Fount the photo-cell. Black taped it. All is well and works like a charm. I am starting disassembly tonight:)

I am going to try to build a KA-50 grip with all the buttons in the proper place including the double trigger. There are certainly more than enough buttons. available between two controllers.

There is a little hole in the front-side of the grip - cover it!

The photocell -is for security -so that the stick is not wandering all over your desk while you are not at home...

Once you are at the stage to dismantle the grip - you can just cut the wires for this photocell .- and the stick will always have power on the FFB.

Awesome work. Wish it was commercially available. Dream stick

:yes:this is great! really

Hi PeterP,

there is no much to say just - :worthy:

hmmm, i guess i will be re-buying the MSFFB2 and join the ebay hunt for a cougar...

ha ha. This is exactly what I have done, got them two from friends that stooped use them, i got used Cougar that will do the job :thumbup: (using Tablet to post is annoying)

Hi Peter, i can´t do your mod, but would like to extend my FFB2. Can you please give me some advise ? How can i remove the handgrip without tearing off the wires etc. ?

Hi Peter, i can´t do your mod, but would like to extend my FFB2. Can you please give me some advise ? How can i remove the handgrip without tearing off the wires etc. ?

you will have to cut it- they are not long enough for doing this - but its very simple after you have a close look at it. The wires have their own colours - so its not really difficult to extend them .

Edit:

And make a lot of photos/notes while disassembly -so you will know how to put everything back together.

This thread contains also a lot of valuable info you are looking for:

Central MS FFB2 topic - repair, settings and mods

Hi PeterP,

what about windows 7 64 bit driver and software, i can see it is not supported, or i am not reading the right article.

Thanks

Hi,

- what article exactly -link ?

-Whatever -

The info you got is half right/wrong.;)

That Means...

Sidwinder Programming Software : Not running in Win7 environments

Solution : use AHK for individual button programming and scripting. >>http://www.autohotkey.com/

MS-Sidwinder-FFB2 driver:

Are available for all OS in 32/64bit and will be loaded automatically when you plug the controller in with windows-update.

So don't mix up drivers with software.

Further:

You may ask yourself if the FFB will work without the software correctly..?!

The answer is: Yes!

The FFB information is provided through DirectX and not by this Sidwinder-software.

The FFB is a part of the DirectX protocol since DX7(maybe also since DX5.. ?! - I'm not sure) - and is also included in DX11. so don't worry.

As long a developer uses the DX-SDKs correctly to program FFB effects in their software the MS-Sidwinder FFB2 will be able to execute them.

(as you can see in my Videos...:) )

I hope this explanation clears all of your questions.

Yap Mr Pp.

You have answered to all my q regarding Drivers and Software.

i got two working MS FFB, i will try to make it with one and see if its good for my, if i can make it work together.

Many Thanks for this great thread.:thumbup:

Avi

I added Hall sensors to this build using this instruction:

MOD Spécial KA For TM Cougar By KAMOV

I used the unused X/Y axis of the HOTAS-Cougar for connection.

The Hall-sensors and magnets came from a broken X-52 that I got really cheap on ebay - to cannibalise it for other projects.

But 5V driven Linear-Hall-Sensors are really cheap (about 2.5€ each) - so you don't have to get a X-52 for doing this.

Sorry - all photos that I took are too blurry - so I edited a "CGI" image to show you how I attached the hall-sensors and magnets by using mainly hot-glue.

I measured roughly the linearity oft them and I got this results:

You can see that they are not working linear - and I expected this, because the hall-sensors move on a radius between the two magnets.- It takes much time and testing to place the magnets exactly. Something I didn't had the nerves for... :P

And the images of the curves I have sure done some small measurement failures .

So I have to use a highly customised curve in DCS-10 to compensate this and let them work linear again. - but if I hadn't measured it in DX-Tweak - I barley wouldn't had noticed it!

I use the "new x/y" for pitch/bank only in DCS A-10 now.

In BlackShark I still only use the X/Y axis of the upper MS-FFB2 . because I wasn't able to synchronise the FFB wit the axis readout. But that is no problem at all.

And to be honest - I really can't tell that I have a better precession right now. And I wouldn't know if the MS-FFB provides the axis input or the Cougar ... I just did it because I could :) - and yup! - now I can tell I have Hall sensors on it! :D