Air-to-Air Missile Discussion

I don't see ER's being fixed at all... they are as stupid as they ever were... still go for chaff all the time. I cannot get them to track/hit even stupid A-10's... they don't even have to go to beam... 6 ER's fired and they all stop tracking very easily.

Then I guess next patch.

 

Ah, I see, I think thrust vectoring has gone in.

I don't see ER's being fixed at all... they are as stupid as they ever were... still go for chaff all the time. I cannot get them to track/hit even stupid A-10's... they don't even have to go to beam... 6 ER's fired and they all stop tracking very easily.

 

 

Well probably you have right. I have made a short test against one F-15. I will do more tests, but I do not expect any improvement. They just downgraded in fact the RU Missiles, but any way the RU fighters try to manage this situation and they keep expecting

How to read missions or campaings in Spanish? I continue reading them in English

From Russian missiles side (not counting R-77), really only the R-73 is good now

Post Track in here plz http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=103377&highlight=%2F%2F%2FRage&page=9. I'm in process testing missiles performance, doesn't feel that ERs are improved at the moment, need more testing, Will compere tracks from 1.2.4 to 1.2.5.

Edited July 23, 2013 by Teknetinium

... I'm no budgie-pilot but does launch not have to be supported until seeker goes active?

I didn't think so. If you don't 'support the launch', doesn't it just mean the missle won't get a mid-flight course correction by the launching aircraft? The missle can still hit but it's chances are lessened if the target aircraft goes evasive.

In game: Depends on the range, and whether you care for them to distinguish one target from another. If you drop the lock at too long a range, a lack of INS will cause the missiles to fly somewhere 'not anywhere near the target' compared to flight WITH INS.

 

Realistically: Same general idea, different details.

 

Back to the game: Missiles lack INS, so Pk is reduced more than realistic for a cheapshot. However, AIM-120's are not fire and forget in RL, nor in-game, so that part is properly represented.

 

In reality: An AIM-120 is fire and forget only at the point it goes active, and even then there is value in supporting the missile (it will use your data to defeat ECM, other countermeasures, and sort targets if there are multiple targets in its field of view).

 

I'm no budgie-pilot but does launch not have to be supported until seeker goes active?

I didn't think so. If you don't 'support the launch', doesn't it just mean the missle won't get a mid-flight course correction by the launching aircraft? The missle can still hit but it's chances are lessened if the target aircraft goes evasive.

There is no mid course update in FC, they fly like SARH then go active, if you drop lock before it goes active it will go into search mode, completely disregarding last known target position.

 

Hopefully this will change in the future with DCS:F-18 because as it is there are some outlandish pros and cons with how this seeker behaves.

I'm tempted to say 'there is a mid-course update, but not INS', but I guess that's a better way of describing it ... it's like all missiles are homing-all-the-way. Although the mechanics of a data-link and seeker activation/detection range are modeled, they are modeled in a very strange way.

 

There is no mid course update in FC, they fly like SARH then go active, if you drop lock before it goes active it will go into search mode, completely disregarding last known target position.

INS, last known aspect and going active at the predetermined intercept would be a great addition instead of immediate maddog after lock drop.

Cheapshot. Maddogs have no carrier radar input whatsoever at any stage of the intercept. In fact, they behave quite differently even in FC (cheapshot will go into a scan, maddog stares straight ahead when the missile comes off the rail).

 

In reality: An AIM-120 is fire and forget only at the point it goes active, and even then there is value in supporting the missile (it will use your data to defeat ECM, other countermeasures, and sort targets if there are multiple targets in its field of view).

 

Is this behaviour modeled at all in game? If I maintain lock all the way with AIM120C, does it have a higher chance to defeat evasion/CMs at all?

PS. Good to see 120Bs are still utterly useless >4nm :doh:

I'm having issues just getting missiles to hit now honestly. Before I was about 50%. Now, nada. Even IRST vs a target that hasn't seen me yet with a 27ET. I've still had 27ERs fired at max nonm range and max maneuvering range and failed to guide off the rail.

I think Sparrows are having better much better luck than AMRAAMs, ironically...

It's fascinating such an important detail as Air to air missiles performance gets neglected/porked. Again. After so much wait for 1.2.5. But then again, it's not like DCS World is about air combat and stuff so it's really not a big deal.

 

Oh wait..

It's fascinating such an important detail as Air to air missiles performance gets neglected/porked. Again. After so much wait for 1.2.5. But then again, it's not like DCS World is about air combat and stuff so it's really not a big deal.

 

Oh wait..

 

 

I just don't understand EDs priorities.

I guise aim-120 are working and were fixed in 1.2.2 . So everything in Air to Air department is fine, Su-27 is how it should be, have you not heard about default TWS auto-lock. LOL.

Then you tell me F-15 is more popular, there must be a reason for that. And I'm sure su-27 is not flown now because nothing is working inside.

 

At least discouraging me to fly Su-27, And its hard to find bigger fanboy of Su-27 then me. Those who try it for the first time will not even consider to fly Su-27 the way it is now.

 

I would rather have my systems working first before enjoying 3D model.

Edited July 24, 2013 by Teknetinium

It's fascinating such an important detail as Air to air missiles performance gets neglected/porked. Again. After so much wait for 1.2.5. But then again, it's not like DCS World is about air combat and stuff so it's really not a big deal.

 

Oh wait..

 

And who said that missiles will be complete in 1.2.5.? Improvements as stated, yes. Complete, hell no.

Soon, you will find that there are F15Cs playing BVR combat only and that no one fly Su27:mad:

Soon, you will find that there are F15Cs playing BVR combat only and that no one fly Su27:mad:

 

Lol. But we have not choice. The best solution is Play in the F-15 side. Even taking a Su-25 to do some air-ground flight, because the Su and Migs fighters are useless to do their Job

 

. We were requesting to solve this problem and they totaly ignore us. Just take a look how fast the problem of the tactical weapons shoot down by tunguska was solved when the A-10 pilots protest about that.

 

The Kh-25ml shooting by the Su-25A is buggy, and they know it because is a request about that opened... same case of the Air-Air missiles, still waiting...

 

The Missiles AFM can not affect only one side. This is unaceptable

Edited July 24, 2013 by pepin1234

And who said that missiles will be complete in 1.2.5.? Improvements as stated, yes. Complete, hell no.

 

Nobody said the missiles will be "complete" but common sense would dictate after so much work has been put into 1.2.5 and ater such a long wait, and after Nth version update, we would finally see some more noticable progress in that (very important) aspect of the sim. Instead, people who tested the 1.2.5 (even Kuky who is a beta tester) said the ERs, for example, are still porked ie. not very useful. I read something similar about 120B.

 

So, again, and still, with the latest (long awaited) update, the missiles are pretty much at the same level of effectivness as they were in the previous version (or, according to some of the posts here, even worse!).

 

With all due respect, It's just hard not to wonder what is being done all this time on those test build servers if such a huge elephant can pass by unnoticed?

With all due respect, It's just hard not to wonder what is being done all this time on those test build servers if such a huge elephant can pass by unnoticed?

 

Said huge elephant is being consumed one bite at a time lest the team suffers indigestion, or worse, chokes. Keeping in mind that it's an entirely new WAFM implementation it's little wonder that it's taking time - expecting marked improvements in 1.2.5. was way too optimistic.

Yes this Video is the best example of what is happening here.

 

I WANT TO FLIGHT THE RUSSIAN PLANES, BECAUSE I LOVE IT, CLEAR LIKE THE CRYSTAL!!!!

 

We will not accept this AFM Missiles just because there are a lot of interesting customers waiting for a DCS F-18 to use the fantastic Aim-120 by ED.

 

If this Hobby is Too expensive to not get money with the russian pilots customers. THEN PUSH OUT THE RUSSIANS AIRCRAFTS OF THIS SOFTWARE, SOMEONE WILL BRING US SOMETHING FAIR.

Not possible, we need targets.