Force feedback implementation.

So I want to put some force feedback into my joystick. I know how I should mechanically implement it. Stepper motors connected to a the axis in some way, arduino controller, transitions to up the voltage from the arduino to the motors. Wall power for the motors. (Not direct OBV) The potentiometers in the stick for position information for the controller.

Thats the mechanical and 'lectrical. Now, does anyone have any ideas as to how I'd get my computer to communicate with that? Should I maybe find an old FFB stick and frankenstick it in?

Moonshot anyone?

Maybe this help:

http://www.simprojects.nl/diy_force_feedback.htm

http://www.simprojects.nl/ms_siderwinder_ff2_hack.htm

http://bffsimulation.com/FFB-yoke-1.php

'Easiest' way is using the brain from a known good FF stick such as MSFFII to generate the drive signals to run your own hardware. Other FF sticks don't do a good job at generating quality signals so are not worth hacking.

Beyond that, making your own digital interface to extract necessary parameters and then be able to convert them to analog and then into drive signals to run through the amplifiers is exponentially more complicated, and well into the zone of diminishing returns since you will need to craft dedicated interfacing solutions for every single title you want to use it with.

I've dabbled in this realm, and some of my stuff is on Roland van Roy's site linked by Sokol1, namely a circuit used to convert airspeed data>DAC into speed dependent centering forces.

Your best bet is getting an old SMFFII and following Roland's formula above for beefing up its drive output to run bigger motors hooked up to your own hardware. Then you have near plug-n-play FF compatible with tons of titles, with all sorts of effects already there (landing bumps, stall shakes, trim loading, etc) without having to reinvent rather complicated wheels.

Thadiun, do you have an idea if Logitech sticks of earlier model are of any use?

(both with or without hack?)

I got hold of two Logitech, a Strike Force 3D and and a Force 3D.

Just wondering how they compare to a MS Sidewinder FFB 2?

In the past people use Logitech Force 3D boards to upgrade the ancient CH Force FX (Win95 only), but this Logitech models is no more support by actual Windows versions.

Not worth using the Logitech board for this, it does a poor job with the signals and the output in terms of resolution and response. The amount of work you need to do before you have anything worthwhile is the same regardless of what stick you hack, but MSFFII appears to be the only one that does justice with what games natively provide.

Before Roland van Roy figured out how to hack MSFFII he used a Logitech brain and it was very unsatisfactory (laggy, signals didn't make sense vs scenarios, extremely poor output resolution). He replaced it with a full homegrown solution which he used for a long time and was pretty happy with, but that was superseded by his MSFFII hack.

It was done for performance and convenience reasons. His homegrown solution worked ok, but is limited in that it req its own parameter extractor program to be made for literally every application you use it for and then only as detailed as the library of effects which you can custom trigger, which is the appeal of using something that already does the hard part for you -interface with game and generate decent output commands.

In the past people use Logitech Force 3D boards to upgrade the ancient CH Force FX (Win95 only), but this Logitech models is no more support by actual Windows versions.

Not worth using the Logitech board for this, it does a poor job with the signals and the output in terms of resolution and response. The amount of work you need to do before you have anything worthwhile is the same regardless of what stick you hack, but MSFFII appears to be the only one that does justice with what games natively provide.

 

Before Roland van Roy figured out how to hack MSFFII he used a Logitech brain and it was very unsatisfactory (laggy, signals didn't make sense vs scenarios, extremely poor output resolution). He replaced it with a full homegrown solution which he used for a long time and was pretty happy with, but that was superseded by his MSFFII hack.

 

It was done for performance and convenience reasons. His homegrown solution worked ok, but is limited in that it req its own parameter extractor program to be made for literally every application you use it for and then only as detailed as the library of effects which you can custom trigger, which is the appeal of using something that already does the hard part for you -interface with game and generate decent output commands.

Ok, thanks both of you. :)

It's just, I came over a batch of surplus PC joysticks quite cheap, and among them was a MS FFB 2 and the Logitech sticks, just wanted an idea what to expect. :)

About the Logitech sticks, it seems they can be brought to work on newer Windows versions, so was going to experiment with that.

Just for the fun of it. :)